Mock with Common Sense

[Make It Rain 313]

I know this will all be hammered since everyone thinks we can have an elite offense with a Tandem of the 5 RB's already on board. Fact is none of them are even average starting caliber RB's. I also made this based on the assumption we go to a 3-4 which with Justin heading out of town and the tagging of any DT's on the free agent market who could upgrade the Thornton/Peko/Myers pu pu platter and very few starting caliber 4-3 DE's.
Also, I made it with the assumption that Dorsey, C Long, Gholston and Ellis are gone and that we don't sign a stud FA RB (either M. Barber or M. Turner). I can see going with any of them as they are all elite talent and we need elite talent in the putrid front 7 and trying to get by with the guys on board at RB.
The reason I go with Stewart at #9 is that while Rivers and Merling will probably be solid guys, they will probably never go to a Pro Bowl while I can see Stewart being an instant impact for this year and also being a perennial pro bowler type back. I think if we got him we would have the most explosive Offense in the league bar none. If we can get a balanced attack on offense with a solid running game, I think we can win with a mediocore D winning a bunch of 38-24 games.
We can find comparable talent in later rounds for defense help as opposed to if we were to go RB in any other round, even the 2nd. The value just isn't there to go RB if we don't get D Mac, Stewart or Mendenhall.
Something like this would work and would be filling needs while drafting the Best player likely to be available at this stage.

1st-Jonathan Stewart OR- RB
2nd- Trevor Laws ND-DT ( 3-4 DE at 297 lbs )
3rd- Shawn Crable Mich-OLB
Comp 3rd- Phillip Wheeler GT-ILB (245lbs, 4.55 40 time)
4th- Red Bryant Texas AM-DT (3-4 Nose)
5th Kellen Davis Mich St-TE
6th J Leman ILL-LB (Special teams standout, good depth)
Comp 7th-Angelo Craig UC- DE/OLB (ST, raw pass rush talent)

[DennyG2]

With respect, if we drafted like that, there would be an uprising in bengal land.:scared2:

[EatonFan]

Please re-title your thread to "Mock with UN-Common Sense". Ain't gonna happen...

[Bech72]

Red Bryant is rated as the 4th or 5th DT on most lists, no way he lasts until the 4th

[thunderj4]

why would we draft a RB with our first pick we have 4 or 5 i forget

[mrcrockj]

I don't think its completely illogical to draft a RB in the first round, there is no way we are going to take 3 LB's. And if you listen to Marvin's interviews, he's looking for pass rushers. That will come before the 7th round.

[emfwhodey]

i'm not a big fan of picking a running back in the first...and i don't think red bryant would be there in the fourth last time i checked he was ranked higher than laws...granted i would be estatic if we ended up with crabble (who i think is a steal in this draft especially in round 3), laws, and bryant...if we get those three players i might be able to over look drafting a RB in the first

[bengalboy5]

And I've been arguning that we shouldn't even consider McFadden...and I thought that Rudi was an average RB, his 1400 yard 6+ TD seasons are flukes...and that we just used last year's 2nd round pick on a guy who we will cut, another college fluke?...not to mention a first round pick a few years ago...and Watsons 100+ yards and 2+ TD games last year were all a fluke too, right?...and Dede is terrible, just a few flukes...wow, we get so many flukes, if we keep this up, we'll be called the Cincy Flukes! It almost seems like there not flukes because we're so consistent. Your logic is amazing![/sarcasm]

[Make It Rain 313]

You people need to take off your homer goggles for a second. Running back is this team's 2nd biggest need after the d line if you look at the starting lineup as constructed and I was saying that if all the elite guys d line prospects are off the board as projected universally,then we should target another elite talent with that #9 pick as opposed to settling with the 2nd tier of guys of front seven guys likely to be available. Jonathan Stewart is nearly a Stephen Jackson clone without quite as good of hands but he can still catch the ball. If any of you can say you think over the next 5 years that Jonathan Stewart won't have a bigger impact than Keith Rivers, Kentwan Balmer, Phillip Merling or Derrick Harvey in the NFL then don't read any further because obviously you need to get back to being the chaffeur for Mikey B in his Buick.

Does anyone who is a Vikings fan really think that taking AP at #7 last year was a bad pick since they had needs much worse than RB and Chester Taylor was coming off a 1200 yard season? Not saying J Stew is AP, but the talent is there for him to be a Pro Bowler out of the box if anyone watched Oregon at all the last two years. The explosiveness of having such a good running and passing attack would strike fear in opponents. Does Rudi even in his prime really ever scare the crap out of people the way a Peterson, LT or Steven Jackson do?

Here is the running back breakdown for some of you people that think we already have the offense to win a Super Bowl so we just need to draft the next Alfred Williams or John Copeland and think we had a great draft because we filled a need with our first rounder.

Rudi- 3.8 cap figure for 2.9 ypc. I realize he had a good three year stint post Dillon but the shelf life on a tailback getting as many carries as Rudi who is a power back is only 5-8 years looking historically. Rudi may be able to come back but no one can you plan on him being the same guy he was 04-06. Also injury concerns from the hammy.

Perry- Has proven to be a decent change of pace back, unfortunately we will never find out here because even if he can come back healthy, his replacement was drafted last year. Fred Taylor thinks that Chris Perry is injury prone and needs to man up. Thinking of Perry makes me cringe with what was available in S. Jackson in '04

Watson- 30 yr old career backup who had a couple of good games against putrid defenses. If this guy should be your main back, why did he slip through the cracks for 7 or so seasons on Wash. and our rosters.

Irons- I think if he is fully recovered would be a nice complement in a commitee with Stewart. It would be nice to give him 10 carries a game as his frame isnt built to handle a full load.

Dorsey- A nice guy for his ST and quickness, I am a big 3D fan but come on, you really think a 190 lb NAIA back who has been cut twice in two years is going to share the backfield with Football Jesus? He should definitely be on the roster, but as a 3rd or 4th RB.

To conclude, we have 3 question marks, a career backup and a guy who is a glorified special teamer, its not like we have a Red Grange toting the rock for the Ironton Tanks. It makes no sense not to get a franchise player with a top 10 pick and that is what Stewart will be. As for addressing front 7 needs, we have 9 picks I believe after the losing Fitzpatrick 7th rounder. We can get at least 3 or 4 d linemen from that group of picks with the great depth this year on d line and pick up guys who can start day 1 with our 2nd and maybe even or or both 3rd rounders.

[DCBengalFreak]

I'm somewhere on the middle on this one.

I think RB is an issue, just because everyone we have is a question mark. You'd all have to agree with that.

On the other hand, usually you can find good RBs in lots of places, not just at the top of the 1st. Dillon was a second rounder, Rudi a 4th, Dorsey undrafted. It similar across the league, good RBs can be found lots of places.

Therefore, I'm with you that we need to look at the RB situation and address it, but not neccessarily at #9. Now, if we traded down, then maybe we could talk about it. Especially if we pick up some Defensive linemen in FA.

[Since82]

I know this will all be hammered since everyone thinks we can have an elite offense with a Tandem of the 5 RB's already on board. Fact is none of them are even average starting caliber RB's. I also made this based on the assumption we go to a 3-4 which with Justin heading out of town and the tagging of any DT's on the free agent market who could upgrade the Thornton/Peko/Myers pu pu platter and very few starting caliber 4-3 DE's.
Also, I made it with the assumption that Dorsey, C Long, Gholston and Ellis are gone and that we don't sign a stud FA RB (either M. Barber or M. Turner). I can see going with any of them as they are all elite talent and we need elite talent in the putrid front 7 and trying to get by with the guys on board at RB.
The reason I go with Stewart at #9 is that while Rivers and Merling will probably be solid guys, they will probably never go to a Pro Bowl while I can see Stewart being an instant impact for this year and also being a perennial pro bowler type back. I think if we got him we would have the most explosive Offense in the league bar none. If we can get a balanced attack on offense with a solid running game, I think we can win with a mediocore D winning a bunch of 38-24 games.
We can find comparable talent in later rounds for defense help as opposed to if we were to go RB in any other round, even the 2nd. The value just isn't there to go RB if we don't get D Mac, Stewart or Mendenhall.
Something like this would work and would be filling needs while drafting the Best player likely to be available at this stage.

1st-Jonathan Stewart OR- RB
2nd- Trevor Laws ND-DT ( 3-4 DE at 297 lbs )
3rd- Shawn Crable Mich-OLB
Comp 3rd- Phillip Wheeler GT-ILB (245lbs, 4.55 40 time)
4th- Red Bryant Texas AM-DT (3-4 Nose)
5th Kellen Davis Mich St-TE
6th J Leman ILL-LB (Special teams standout, good depth)
Comp 7th-Angelo Craig UC- DE/OLB (ST, raw pass rush talent)

Therein lies my whole problem with this scenerio. Stewart may be a pro bowl caliber player, but Stewart at #9? If he was that big of a stud why didn't he shoulder the burden when Dixson went down? He has some good NFL traits and will be a first rounder, but to take any offensive player this year at number nine means that they have to be about five levels above any defensive player. You said it yourself, with an average defense the Bengals can go to the playoffs. Merling, Harvey, Rivers, Phillips, whomever, might never get to the Pro Bowl, but if you watched the Super Bowl, most of us saw what an "average" defensive line can do with a great game plan.

I would also say that a Pro Bowl running back and a first round running back aren't nearly as synonymous as you might believe.

Finally. you can't throw your opinion around like its fact then get annoyed and defensive when people disagree with you. It will be a long (or short) life on the boards.

[thunderj4]

You people need to take off your homer goggles for a second. Running back is this team's 2nd biggest need after the d line if you look at the starting lineup as constructed and I was saying that if all the elite guys d line prospects are off the board as projected universally,then we should target another elite talent with that #9 pick as opposed to settling with the 2nd tier of guys of front seven guys likely to be available. Jonathan Stewart is nearly a Stephen Jackson clone without quite as good of hands but he can still catch the ball. If any of you can say you think over the next 5 years that Jonathan Stewart won't have a bigger impact than Keith Rivers, Kentwan Balmer, Phillip Merling or Derrick Harvey in the NFL then don't read any further because obviously you need to get back to being the chaffeur for Mikey B in his Buick.

Does anyone who is a Vikings fan really think that taking AP at #7 last year was a bad pick since they had needs much worse than RB and Chester Taylor was coming off a 1200 yard season? Not saying J Stew is AP, but the talent is there for him to be a Pro Bowler out of the box if anyone watched Oregon at all the last two years. The explosiveness of having such a good running and passing attack would strike fear in opponents. Does Rudi even in his prime really ever scare the crap out of people the way a Peterson, LT or Steven Jackson do?

Here is the running back breakdown for some of you people that think we already have the offense to win a Super Bowl so we just need to draft the next Alfred Williams or John Copeland and think we had a great draft because we filled a need with our first rounder.

Rudi- 3.8 cap figure for 2.9 ypc. I realize he had a good three year stint post Dillon but the shelf life on a tailback getting as many carries as Rudi who is a power back is only 5-8 years looking historically. Rudi may be able to come back but no one can you plan on him being the same guy he was 04-06. Also injury concerns from the hammy.

Perry- Has proven to be a decent change of pace back, unfortunately we will never find out here because even if he can come back healthy, his replacement was drafted last year. Fred Taylor thinks that Chris Perry is injury prone and needs to man up. Thinking of Perry makes me cringe with what was available in S. Jackson in '04

Watson- 30 yr old career backup who had a couple of good games against putrid defenses. If this guy should be your main back, why did he slip through the cracks for 7 or so seasons on Wash. and our rosters.

Irons- I think if he is fully recovered would be a nice complement in a commitee with Stewart. It would be nice to give him 10 carries a game as his frame isnt built to handle a full load.

Dorsey- A nice guy for his ST and quickness, I am a big 3D fan but come on, you really think a 190 lb NAIA back who has been cut twice in two years is going to share the backfield with Football Jesus? He should definitely be on the roster, but as a 3rd or 4th RB.

To conclude, we have 3 question marks, a career backup and a guy who is a glorified special teamer, its not like we have a Red Grange toting the rock for the Ironton Tanks. It makes no sense not to get a franchise player with a top 10 pick and that is what Stewart will be. As for addressing front 7 needs, we have 9 picks I believe after the losing Fitzpatrick 7th rounder. We can get at least 3 or 4 d linemen from that group of picks with the great depth this year on d line and pick up guys who can start day 1 with our 2nd and maybe even or or both 3rd rounders.

I dont think running back is our second biggest problem we have a good vetrean in Rudi who will do well next year. A good young guy in kenny irons. On top of that we have Watson and Perry who are both good backs. Seems like we are ok there to me. Also if RB is our second biggest problem why not adress it later in the draft.