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View Full Version : Root for Madieu, Justin and Landon to tear it up....


3 Johnsons and a Big Willie
08-08-2008, 08:45 AM
Now, let me go on record as saying I'm not ALREADY looking toward the '09 season. I believe with a renewed sense of urgency, a dedication to the run and the intensity of Zimmer that the Bengals are in for good things this year. However.....

I hope that Williams, Smith and Johnson play every single down and just light the league up this year. Why you ask? Supplemental picks in the '09 draft. I'm not certain of the formula for calculating the draft picks you get, but I know it's based on playing time, achievement and the contract details you received with your new team. Considering the money given to Smith and Williams, you know those guys are playing every down they can. If they both play good football this year, we're probably looking at a 3rd rounder for both guys. Whether those picks are exercised, or used as trade bait, that could spell very good things for this team in the coming year....

bengal_fan
08-08-2008, 08:49 AM
Now, let me go on record as saying I'm not ALREADY looking toward the '09 season. I believe with a renewed sense of urgency, a dedication to the run and the intensity of Zimmer that the Bengals are in for good things this year. However.....

I hope that Williams, Smith and Johnson play every single down and just light the league up this year. Why you ask? Supplemental picks in the '09 draft. I'm not certain of the formula for calculating the draft picks you get, but I know it's based on playing time, achievement and the contract details you received with your new team. Considering the money given to Smith and Williams, you know those guys are playing every down they can. If they both play good football this year, we're probably looking at a 3rd rounder for both guys. Whether those picks are exercised, or used as trade bait, that could spell very good things for this team in the coming year....

why are you looking to the 09 season.

3 Johnsons and a Big Willie
08-08-2008, 08:55 AM
You must have missed the first sentence, with that crucial part about NOT already writing off this season for the purpose of looking at next. But I digress.

I only started thinking about this as I've been doing a lot of reading, trying to get ready for the FF season, and came across the training camp puff pieces about how truly AWESOME williams and smith are going to make their new defenses. Just saying I hope it comes true, all the more to benefit Cincy in the future.

lost33cause
08-08-2008, 09:02 AM
Supplemental picks are based mostly on how much money they got. With the amount of money the 2 got we should get a 3rd for each player. However, we cannot trade away supplemental picks.

fredtoast
08-08-2008, 09:03 AM
I liked all of those guys, so I will be rooting for them to do well anyway.

I'm guessing that Odom will cancel out Madieu (they got almost exactly the same amount of money), but that would mean that we could still get a third for Justin and a late rounder for Johnson.

Teams are trading Pro Bowlers for third round picks these days, so these supplemental picks are huge.

lost33cause
08-08-2008, 09:06 AM
^^
forgot about Odom.

TS87
08-08-2008, 10:31 AM
you cant trade Supplemental picks. so there is no trade bate... but it would be nice to pick up another patt simms, or a speedy running back for the 09 season. but its gonna **** having the 32 overall pick of the 09 draft lol

Magikod
08-08-2008, 10:35 AM
you cant trade Supplemental picks. so there is no trade bate... but it would be nice to pick up another patt simms, or a speedy running back for the 09 season. but its gonna **** having the 32 overall pick of the 09 draft lol

:thumbsup:

PhxBENGALfanatic
08-08-2008, 10:47 AM
The Bengals can trade the original 3rd rounder and pick prospects with the two supplemental picks. So receiving 2 third round picks in my opinion is huge. We never really make moves but it would be good to see some activity if hole still exist on the team.

pedlershred
08-08-2008, 10:51 AM
I think Odom cancels out Smith, and B. Johnson and Blackstock cancel out Landon Johnson+ a bit of Madieu.... So we'll get a 5th or 6th rounder out of that, Maybe.

dont forget, if Pollack ever offically retires there should be some compensation for that. And im not sure if you get any compensation for waived players, doubt it, but maybe Goodell will take that into consideraition since character cuts Thurman and Henry hurt too. But I doubt it since he hates Mike Brown and the Bengals.

fredtoast
08-08-2008, 10:53 AM
I think Odom cancels out Smith, and B. Johnson and Blackstock cancel out Landon Johnson+ a bit of Madieu.... So we'll get a 5th or 6th rounder out of that, Maybe.

Odom signed for the same money as Madieu. So how can Odom be rated high enough to cancel out Justin while Madieu only gets us a 5th or 6th rounder?

Brandon Johnson ($445,000) and Blackstock ($560,000) both signed one year deals worth a TOTAL of $1.05 million. Landon Johnson signed a three year deal worth $10 million.

Your math is all messed up.

The Bengal Thing
08-08-2008, 11:02 AM
Boy.... does this open a HUGE can of worms.

I don't wish ill will towards any of them, nut I think I hope they flop like NO OTHER

If not... all we will hear is how we were mistaken to let them go....etc

I can't handle that...... I hope they are TERRIBLE with their new teams

J24
08-08-2008, 11:06 AM
I will be rooting for Madieu because he is my favorite player, Landon is a good guy so I will be rooting for him, and Justin I guess all root for him. None of those players will be playing us this regular season so I dont think its bad to root for them.

tenacious-B
08-08-2008, 11:48 AM
Boy.... does this open a HUGE can of worms.

I don't wish ill will towards any of them, nut I think I hope they flop like NO OTHER

If not... all we will hear is how we were mistaken to let them go....etc

I can't handle that...... I hope they are TERRIBLE with their new teams


I'm with you B-thang. I hope Justin smells as bad as the homeless urine in SF's Haight-Ashbury district, and I also would like Madieu to reek it up as well. I actually would like to see Landon do well, he was always such a good guy, but who gives a crap about the other two...both overrated in my opinion.

dr1441
08-08-2008, 11:56 AM
I'm with you B-thang. I hope Justin smells as bad as the homeless urine in SF's Haight-Ashbury district, and I also would like Madieu to reek it up as well. I actually would like to see Landon do well, he was always such a good guy, but who gives a crap about the other two...both overrated in my opinion.

Agreed :thumbsup:

Landon played everywhere and never complained once. Cant hate on a guy like that. But I couldnt stand Smith when he was here let alone now! Thank goodness for him moving on. I dont think I could take watching him getting pushed around at the line and waiting for people to run to him to get a tackle anymore. :shock:

LEATHER FACE
08-08-2008, 11:59 AM
I like peanut butter and cherry preserves on my bread.

bonkfire
08-08-2008, 12:15 PM
I like peanut butter and cherry preserves on my bread.

Gave the dog peanut butter last night...they kids were laughing their heads off!!!

The NFL does not give picks for bozos cut or injured players lost either, for that matter. From ESPN:

"The NFL Management Council determines the number and value of the compensatory picks, and it guards the secrecy of its compensatory formula like Coke guards its secret recipe. This much is known: The NFL formula is based on salary, playing time, postseason awards and the net of free agents lost versus free agents signed."

Therefore, team should receive a third for Smith regardless, and only a later compensation for Williams and/or Johnson IF they make playoffs or lead league in categories. Otherwise, look for a couple of seventh-rounders.

SnapCount80
08-08-2008, 12:22 PM
Williams will be a strong addition to the Vikings who are built like no other to stop the run. Smith will probably be as effective in SF as he was here. Johnson will likely be used in a similar fashion in Carolina as he was here, though will probably have a little better numbers because of the surrounding cast.

To find out what they mean for supplemental picks, we should probably send WestTX an email. The guy has answers on a lot of these questions. ;)

battey60
08-08-2008, 12:28 PM
Boy.... does this open a HUGE can of worms.

I don't wish ill will towards any of them, nut I think I hope they flop like NO OTHER

If not... all we will hear is how we were mistaken to let them go....etc

I can't handle that...... I hope they are TERRIBLE with their new teams



I read some articles about Justin in San Fran, how they were saying he has a new lease in life and they are giving him looks all over the field, he has even lined up at LBer. Now why on earth did we not think of moving Bull rushing Smith around? We left him at one side of the line and doomed him to mediocraty. Thank God Chucky B is gone what a tool.


Madieu will be in the top safeties tackling wise this year ( barring no injury) He is back in Leslie Fraziers D and Leslie is said to put Madieu as one of the keys to his D.

As for Landon I honestly do not think he will be starting this year. The panthers have a talented LBing core and they like their LBers to be 240 or above, which puzzles me as to why they selected Landon in the first place at 230. He will not make much of an impact in Carolina.

SnapCount80
08-08-2008, 01:12 PM
I read some articles about Justin in San Fran, how they were saying he has a new lease in life and they are giving him looks all over the field, he has even lined up at LBer. Now why on earth did we not think of moving Bull rushing Smith around? We left him at one side of the line and doomed him to mediocraty. Thank God Chucky B is gone what a tool.


Madieu will be in the top safeties tackling wise this year ( barring no injury) He is back in Leslie Fraziers D and Leslie is said to put Madieu as one of the keys to his D.

As for Landon I honestly do not think he will be starting this year. The panthers have a talented LBing core and they like their LBers to be 240 or above, which puzzles me as to why they selected Landon in the first place at 230. He will not make much of an impact in Carolina.You might want to see a few games before you start patting San Fran on the back. How did we doom Smith to mediocrity? He was a defensive end from college and SHOULD have been able to dominate his natural position. That's what a pro is supposed to do. They shouldn't need to baby the 4th overall draft pick.

I agree about your views on Williams.

I don't think Carolina picked up Landon with the intent to start him. He is a good depth player and versatile across the LB spots. He will probably be used rotational to keep the starters fresh unless an injury pushes him into the starting role. That's why I said he would be used in a similar fashion to the Bengals.

DennyG2
08-08-2008, 01:22 PM
Now, let me go on record as saying I'm not ALREADY looking toward the '09 season. I believe with a renewed sense of urgency, a dedication to the run and the intensity of Zimmer that the Bengals are in for good things this year. However.....

I hope that Williams, Smith and Johnson play every single down and just light the league up this year. Why you ask? Supplemental picks in the '09 draft. I'm not certain of the formula for calculating the draft picks you get, but I know it's based on playing time, achievement and the contract details you received with your new team. Considering the money given to Smith and Williams, you know those guys are playing every down they can. If they both play good football this year, we're probably looking at a 3rd rounder for both guys. Whether those picks are exercised, or used as trade bait, that could spell very good things for this team in the coming year....
I root for Bengals and Bengals players only.......sorry:smirk:

Big Ern
08-08-2008, 03:27 PM
Now, let me go on record as saying I'm not ALREADY looking toward the '09 season. I believe with a renewed sense of urgency, a dedication to the run and the intensity of Zimmer that the Bengals are in for good things this year. However.....

I hope that Williams, Smith and Johnson play every single down and just light the league up this year. Why you ask? Supplemental picks in the '09 draft. I'm not certain of the formula for calculating the draft picks you get, but I know it's based on playing time, achievement and the contract details you received with your new team. Considering the money given to Smith and Williams, you know those guys are playing every down they can. If they both play good football this year, we're probably looking at a 3rd rounder for both guys. Whether those picks are exercised, or used as trade bait, that could spell very good things for this team in the coming year....

Perhaps you mean 08 season, unless your already chalking it up

battey60
08-08-2008, 03:36 PM
Perhaps you mean 08 season, unless your already chalking it up



thats strike 2 :thumbsup: your the second person that failed to read the first sentence of 3 johnson's post carefully. Congrats :Clap:

pedlershred
08-08-2008, 04:30 PM
Odom signed for the same money as Madieu. So how can Odom be rated high enough to cancel out Justin while Madieu only gets us a 5th or 6th rounder?

Brandon Johnson ($445,000) and Blackstock ($560,000) both signed one year deals worth a TOTAL of $1.05 million. Landon Johnson signed a three year deal worth $10 million.

Your math is all messed up.

I dont need math.. my gut tells me everything I need to know about football. And when to eat too, all you gut does is add.

Johnson = Johnson... That is math you, nor you gut, cannot argue with. WhoDey!

battey60
08-08-2008, 04:38 PM
You might want to see a few games before you start patting San Fran on the back. How did we doom Smith to mediocrity? He was a defensive end from college and SHOULD have been able to dominate his natural position. That's what a pro is supposed to do. They shouldn't need to baby the 4th overall draft pick.

I agree about your views on Williams.

I don't think Carolina picked up Landon with the intent to start him. He is a good depth player and versatile across the LB spots. He will probably be used rotational to keep the starters fresh unless an injury pushes him into the starting role. That's why I said he would be used in a similar fashion to the Bengals.



True but after realizing that Smith does nothing but Bull-rush, why on earth would you not want to get the most out of your player. If he does one thing and one thing only why not give him different looks all over the field.

True he SHOULD have been able to dominate but he in no way COULD. So why not try different things? Teams knew exactly where he was going to be and they knew exactly how to handle his bull-rush. He has been there bull-rushing in one spot for years. mix it up.

SnapCount80
08-08-2008, 05:00 PM
True but after realizing that Smith does nothing but Bull-rush, why on earth would you not want to get the most out of your player. If he does one thing and one thing only why not give him different looks all over the field.

True he SHOULD have been able to dominate but he in no way COULD. So why not try different things? Teams knew exactly where he was going to be and they knew exactly how to handle his bull-rush. He has been there bull-rushing in one spot for years. mix it up.
How much can you really mix up a bull rush? Whether he does it from the left or the right, from an LB position or DE, the defense knows he's coming the same way every time. I guess if the 49ers switch it up, we'll find out. But I just don't see how an offensive line could be tricked by a one trick pony. Besides, I would put the pressure on Justin to mix his game up. Why should the coaches be forced to bend over backward to accommodate an underachiever? Or was it that the coaches turned him into an underachiever?... He did set the club rookie sack record. From there it all went down hill.

battey60
08-08-2008, 05:39 PM
How much can you really mix up a bull rush? Whether he does it from the left or the right, from an LB position or DE, the defense knows he's coming the same way every time. I guess if the 49ers switch it up, we'll find out. But I just don't see how an offensive line could be tricked by a one trick pony. Besides, I would put the pressure on Justin to mix his game up. Why should the coaches be forced to bend over backward to accommodate an underachiever? Or was it that the coaches turned him into an underachiever?... He did set the club rookie sack record. From there it all went down hill.


The coach in 2001 was **** Lebeau. that was one of the best defenses that we had in years due to Lebeau's defensive coaching. He knew how to use Smith.

tlotharw
08-08-2008, 05:48 PM
I read some articles about Justin in San Fran, how they were saying he has a new lease in life and they are giving him looks all over the field, he has even lined up at LBer. Now why on earth did we not think of moving Bull rushing Smith around? We left him at one side of the line and doomed him to mediocraty. Thank God Chucky B is gone what a tool.


Madieu will be in the top safeties tackling wise this year ( barring no injury) He is back in Leslie Fraziers D and Leslie is said to put Madieu as one of the keys to his D.

As for Landon I honestly do not think he will be starting this year. The panthers have a talented LBing core and they like their LBers to be 240 or above, which puzzles me as to why they selected Landon in the first place at 230. He will not make much of an impact in Carolina.

Here is what Diggs is saying about Landon, who will probably be his primary back up at strong side linebacker.

http://www.panthers.com/Common/Article.aspx?id=35744

Here is an article on Smith's role with the 49ers. Interesting, as you say, how Nathan, formerly of the Ravens, knew exactly what was coming from Smith, and probably from the entire defense. But, them counting on him to be the primary pass rusher is just play foolish.

http://www.sacbee.com/100/story/1116367.html

49er fans will get used to seeing Justin chase down a play from behind on the other side of the field, 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage. That was where he seemed to get all his tackles with the Bengals. I don't think moving him around will do much of anything.

BengalTrucker
08-08-2008, 11:19 PM
Please GOD. Please let me watch Justin Smith try to cover a TE, or a back comming out of the backfield as a LB. I need a good laugh.

Moveing Smith around will not help them much. Remember we tried to use him at the other end position one year and it did not work. We dropped him off in coverage and who ever he was covering was wide open.

Justin Smith may be one of the 5 most over rated veteran player in the NFL right now.

As for Williams, he couldn't cover here and will not be able to cover a TE in Minnesota.

Slappy from New Haven
08-09-2008, 01:31 AM
Boy.... does this open a HUGE can of worms.

I don't wish ill will towards any of them, nut I think I hope they flop like NO OTHER

If not... all we will hear is how we were mistaken to let them go....etc

I can't handle that...... I hope they are TERRIBLE with their new teams

Damn Thing I hate agreeing with anything you say but......

They play for teams that are not the Bengals so they are dead to me.

Yes I know there are crafdt ramification but I think we already have 9-10 next year do we not?

I also thing utecht counts against us does he not?

Slappy from New Haven
08-09-2008, 01:34 AM
How much can you really mix up a bull rush? Whether he does it from the left or the right, from an LB position or DE, the defense knows he's coming the same way every time. I guess if the 49ers switch it up, we'll find out. But I just don't see how an offensive line could be tricked by a one trick pony. Besides, I would put the pressure on Justin to mix his game up. Why should the coaches be forced to bend over backward to accommodate an underachiever? Or was it that the coaches turned him into an underachiever?... He did set the club rookie sack record. From there it all went down hill.

Wouldn't it be nice if we had the Niners this year.

Willie mor Stacy could officially change his name to "pancake"Smith

DQUIG
08-09-2008, 01:59 AM
I didn't read any post or what was even said by the dude that post this thread, but I can tell this should be in klotch under the thread FAIL.:dunce::thumbsup:

fredtoast
08-09-2008, 09:24 AM
Dang, I forgot completely about Utecht. That may keep us from getting as good a supplemental pick as I thought,



BTW teh Forty Niners runa 3-4 (or they did last year) so Smith will have completely different responsibilities there. If he stays at end he will be expected to stuff the run instead of rush the passer. That should play mjore to his strengths than the 4-3 we ran here.

battey60
08-09-2008, 11:16 AM
Dang, I forgot completely about Utecht. That may keep us from getting as good a supplemental pick as I thought,



BTW teh Forty Niners runa 3-4 (or they did last year) so Smith will have completely different responsibilities there. If he stays at end he will be expected to stuff the run instead of rush the passer. That should play mjore to his strengths than the 4-3 we ran here.



yeah but they are switching him Between OLB and DE in that 3-4. I Imagine if they are thinking that on passing downs he should be an OLB rushing the Passer, and on running downs a DE stuffing the run. Makes sense to me. I am positive he will have 8+ sacks this year, Mark it down. I don't miss him one bit tho' , Odom brings a different feel to this defense, and Rivers will more that make up for the Tackles lost by Smith, and hopefully the tackles will be at the Line of Scrimmage and not 5 yards down the field like ol' smitty.

tlotharw
08-10-2008, 12:57 AM
Now, let me go on record as saying I'm not ALREADY looking toward the '09 season. I believe with a renewed sense of urgency, a dedication to the run and the intensity of Zimmer that the Bengals are in for good things this year. However.....

I hope that Williams, Smith and Johnson play every single down and just light the league up this year. Why you ask? Supplemental picks in the '09 draft. I'm not certain of the formula for calculating the draft picks you get, but I know it's based on playing time, achievement and the contract details you received with your new team. Considering the money given to Smith and Williams, you know those guys are playing every down they can. If they both play good football this year, we're probably looking at a 3rd rounder for both guys. Whether those picks are exercised, or used as trade bait, that could spell very good things for this team in the coming year....

Madieu was held out of Minnesota's first game because of neck spasms.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/recap?game_id=29790&displayPage=tab_recap&season=2008&week=PRE1

The 49ers defense got the ball ran on them. Smith had one tackle and one assist.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/recap?game_id=29791&displayPage=tab_recap&season=2008&week=PRE1&override=true

Landon had one tackle

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter?game_id=29794&season=2008&displayPage=tab_gamecenter

deviant
08-10-2008, 01:43 AM
you cant trade Supplemental picks. so there is no trade bate... but it would be nice to pick up another patt simms, or a speedy running back for the 09 season. but its gonna **** having the 32 overall pick of the 09 draft lol
Depending on where our supplementals end up in the round... perhaps we could trade away our given third round pick, and then just use our supplemental pick to get someone in the third.

Unfortunately with the guys we signed this year as compared to years past, I don't think we'll see as many supplementals, or as many 3rd-5th round supplementals as we expect. We also forget about Utecht, this year we actually spent some money on free agents... so hopefully we get a 3rd for Justin, and maybe we can get a couple in the 6th or 7th for losing Landon and to even out on the Madeiu-Odom situation, and I'm not sure if we can add a couple of less impact type player losses together to make one late rounder.

I imagine after this season we only see about 2 supplemental picks... that is one draw back to spending money in free agency, we don't get 10-12 draft picks like we have grown accustomed to. Of course, we do get a couple starters/additional immediate helpers instead of projects. (If I remember right, we got Ndukwe from a supplemental pick though... if only all our second day picks worked out like him:()

deviant
08-10-2008, 01:45 AM
The 49ers defense got the ball ran on them. Smith had one tackle and one assist.

How many yards down the field were those tackles made<_<

sparky151
08-10-2008, 01:46 AM
The way the comp picks work is that it is based on a net of qualifying free agents signed and lost. Utecht will cancel the departure of Landon since they both got about 3 mil per year. The question is who Odom offsets, either Madieu or Smith. My guess is that he will offset Madieu leaving us a pick based on Smith's contract and performance. It might turn out to be a low 3rd rounder but I wouldn't be surprised if it turned into a 4th rounder.

Slappy from New Haven
08-10-2008, 02:34 AM
Madieu was held out of Minnesota's first game because of neck spasms.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/recap?game_id=29790&displayPage=tab_recap&season=2008&week=PRE1

The 49ers defense got the ball ran on them. Smith had one tackle and one assist.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/recap?game_id=29791&displayPage=tab_recap&season=2008&week=PRE1&override=true

Landon had one tackle

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter?game_id=29794&season=2008&displayPage=tab_gamecenter

Its pre season they will get better


BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA

These tems signed castaways from one of the leauges worst defenses.

Bawahahahahahahahha

The Bengal Thing
08-12-2008, 10:40 AM
Cross M. Williams off this list:



Report: Vikings safety Williams out at least six weeks
ESPN.com news services


The Minnesota Vikings, who finished last in 2007 in pass coverage, were counting on free-agent acquisition Madieu Williams to help change that in 2008 from his safety position.

Now, however, they'll reportedly have to wait a while for him to make an impact. The Star Tribune, citing unnamed sources, reported Tuesday that Williams will miss at least six weeks with an undisclosed neck injury.

Williams missed the Vikings' preseason opener against the Seahawks last Friday with what the team called neck spasms.

The newspaper reported that it's unknown when Williams injured his neck and coach Brad Childress refused to address the injury as he's not required to do so in the preseason.

Williams also wouldn't disclose the nature of his neck injury.

"I'm not allowed to discuss the condition of my injuries," Williams told the Star Tribune. "I think that's something that you've got to talk to Coach [Brad] Childress about, or the trainers."

Williams, who played for the Bengals last season, agreed to a six-year, $33 million contract with the Vikings in the offseason.

Williams is known more for his coverage skills than his hitting, and the Vikings wanted to shore up some of their pass-coverage deficiencies.


http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/traini...ory?id=3531141 (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/traini...ory?id=3531141)

Bengals Mike
08-12-2008, 12:43 PM
Madieu is tearing it up alright, tearing up the Vikings depth chart

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp08/news/story?id=3531141