WR Binns impresses OC Gruden

[Trademark]

OC Jay Gruden on second-year WR Armon Binns, taking part in rookie minicamp for extra work: "He's done nothing but impress me since he got here. Armon's a better player when there is a defense than he is just one-on-ones or routes versus air. In the team setting he runs all the routes the right way and makes good, strong catches."

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/rapid-reports/post/19027913

[Pesky_Vulture]

He had a pretty good TD catch during the O vs D today. Took the lid right off the top of the defense. http://www.bengals.com/media-lounge/videos/Rookie-Minicamp-Offense-vs-Defense-51212/2c2e8ace-f9c1-4064-b6a9-cec55730adc5

[Ron Mexico]

You wouldn't expect them to say that they haven't been impressed with him, but the fact that they keep raving about him seems good to me. I still think Sanu, Shipley, and Jones will all beat him out, but who knows,...

[brian5562]

I know Hobson has talked him up but if all Tate can do is return kicks he may lose his spot.

Green, Shipley, Sanu, Jones, Binns, and then to me a battle between Hawkins, Moore, Whaeln and Tate for that final spot.

[OSUfan]

You wouldn't expect them to say that they haven't been impressed with him, but the fact that they keep raving about him seems good to me. I still think Sanu, Shipley, and Jones will all beat him out, but who knows,...

They do not have to say anything at all. The fact that Gruden continues to mention him is a good thing.

[Columbusbengal]

I still think Sanu, Shipley, and Jones will all beat him out, but who knows,...

I agree, but there will be more than four or five WRs on the team. One factor will be return skills, which will help Tate stay on the team IMO. It could help Binns, too.

[shaolinghost]

You gotta figure Green, Sanu, and Shipley are all guaranteed a roster spot, so that leaves 3 open spots.

These are the guys competing:
Jones
Binns
Whalen
Hawkins
Hazelton
Tate
Moore
Hilton
Rogers

-Binns has impressed in camp
-Jones shows Chad Johnson-like receiving qualities
-Hawkins is a great gadget guy/back-up slot receiver
-Tate is the most veteran guy on the receiver corp
-Whalen looked ok when given a chance last season

So really, I think it comes down to these 5 guys, barring one of the CFAs blowing it up.

[Tigerblood1418]

I hope binns works out, one of the three rook recievers need to really play well this year or aj will have 14 people on him. Brandon tate will be the one left out, we wont cut any of our draft picks from this or previous years and i think hawkins adds another wrinkle or two to our offense that none of the others recievers do. And i dont know if anyone noticed but he was our best gunner on punt coverage last year.

[OSUfan]

I hope binns works out, one of the three rook recievers need to really play well this year or aj will have 14 people on him. Brandon tate will be the one left out, we wont cut any of our draft picks from this or previous years and i think hawkins adds another wrinkle or two to our offense that none of the others recievers do. And i dont know if anyone noticed but he was our best gunner on punt coverage last year.

I believe Whalen is odd man out before Tate is. Tate was near the top of the league in returns last season. Tate also when given chances in New England averaged over 18 yards per reception. Tate has very good speed. I certainly would not count him out.

Whalen while being a very smart and dependable route runner probably brings the least to the table of any of the guys vying for spots. I like Whalen I just do not believe he has the ceiling that the other kids have. I think what you see is what you get with him and there just is not much big play potential.

[fastcash]

I believe Whalen is odd man out before Tate is. Tate was near the top of the league in returns last season. Tate also when given chances in New England averaged over 18 yards per reception. Tate has very good speed. I certainly would not count him out.

Whalen while being a very smart and dependable route runner probably brings the least to the table of any of the guys vying for spots. I like Whalen I just do not believe he has the ceiling that the other kids have. I think what you see is what you get with him and there just is not much big play potential.I believe this is what will happen also. I believe Whalen should get a look from the Browns. He could help them.

[CincyGuy344]

From what I saw Binns looked good in the drills Jones as well sanu didn't stand out to much other than his frame he looks like solid rock
AJ
Binns its his spot to lose at this point
Ship
Sanu
Jones
HAWK or Tate

[Kyle_828]

This is really cool. When was the last time it was a hard decision who will be starting WR? We know for sure Green, Shipley, and Gresham will get the nod. But who will be the no.2 WR?

[McC]

I believe this is what will happen also. I believe Whalen should get a look from the Browns. He could help them.

I sure hope not.

[CincyGuy344]

Whalen will sign with the colts IMO
I love how most of the WR have great hands Binns, ship, Sanu, and Jones catch everything

[redwhodey]

we have good talent with good depth pretty much everywhere. gruden should love all the new weapons. so should zimmer. i just cant wait for this season.

[THE PISTONS]

You gotta figure Green, Sanu, and Shipley are all guaranteed a roster spot, so that leaves 3 open spots.

These are the guys competing:
Jones
Binns
Whalen
Hawkins
Hazelton
Tate
Moore
Hilton
Rogers

-Binns has impressed in camp
-Jones shows Chad Johnson-like receiving qualities
-Hawkins is a great gadget guy/back-up slot receiver
-Tate is the most veteran guy on the receiver corp
-Whalen looked ok when given a chance last season

So really, I think it comes down to these 5 guys, barring one of the CFAs blowing it up.

What is the special teams outlook for these guys? Can any return kicks/punts besides Tate?

[Skyblade]

This is really cool. When was the last time it was a hard decision who will be starting WR? We know for sure Green, Shipley, and Gresham will get the nod. But who will be the no.2 WR?
It would be better if it were a tough decision because of a deep pool of quality proven players. But I guess a deep pool of unproven potential is likely to turn out at least one or two gems.

[Tigerblood1418]

I believe Whalen is odd man out before Tate is. Tate was near the top of the league in returns last season. Tate also when given chances in New England averaged over 18 yards per reception. Tate has very good speed. I certainly would not count him out.

Whalen while being a very smart and dependable route runner probably brings the least to the table of any of the guys vying for spots. I like Whalen I just do not believe he has the ceiling that the other kids have. I think what you see is what you get with him and there just is not much big play potential.
I think tate and whalen are gone. We only lost one reciever from last year and thats jerome simpson and we have added three if you include binns to the active roster. my list goes aj,shipley,sanu, marvin jones,binns, and hawkins. And the only way tate makes the team is if we cut pacman and i think he will make it since he is a much better returner the tate.

[Shake n Blake]

I think our WR's will wind up like this:

Green
Sanu
Shipley
Binns
Jones
Moore

I think Whalen is really overrated by some. I think he has a low ceiling. I think the team is looking at other options as far as return duties, so I think Tate's days might be numbered. Hawkins is the toughest cut, but I really think Moore can do what Hawkins did last year AND be capable of playing outside if needed. He's just faster, more athletic and more versatile than Hawk.

[bengalfan74]

I think our WR's will wind up like this:

Green
Sanu
Shipley
Binns
Jones
Moore

I think Whalen is really overrated by some. I think he has a low ceiling. I think the team is looking at other options as far as return duties, so I think Tate's days might be numbered. Hawkins is the toughest cut, but I really think Moore can do what Hawkins did last year AND be capable of playing outside if needed. He's just faster, more athletic and more versatile than Hawk.

Probably pretty close shake.

Binns has a good set of hands and I could easily see him making the cut. Problem is, I could just as easily see Hawk making it. It's gonna be an all out war at WR, I love it ! ! !

[Ron Mexico]

I agree, but there will be more than four or five WRs on the team. One factor will be return skills, which will help Tate stay on the team IMO. It could help Binns, too.

I was only saying the guys that I think will most likely beat him out on the roster. IMO, it's a fight for the #5 and the #6 spots, between a hell of a lot of guys. I would also bet that Tate makes it....so I think the last spot comes down to Hawkins vs. Binns. If the coaching staff likes Binns as much as they say....he'll make the roster.

[grampahol]

I'd like to get in on the action betting who will cry the most their favorite was cut.. ala Briscoe..:wink:

[Bryan]

This is really cool. When was the last time it was a hard decision who will be starting WR? We know for sure Green, Shipley, and Gresham will get the nod. But who will be the no.2 WR?

IMO Shipley will be #2. He'll have the second most targets at WR behind AJ. And imo in our 2 WR sets it will be him and AJ and Ship will move into the slot when we go 3 wide.

[1whodeybrew]

If Tate makes the team it's only due to his experience. I highly doubt Tate will be the 2nd best WR on this team. Binns has a real chance to win this job and Sanu can also return kicks as well which could make it hard for Tate to stick on this team because Jones is returning kicks in this camp. I actually believe they should use Jones to return KO's and Sanu for punt returns. Whalen has very good hands and runs great routes so I actually believe Whalen would beat Tate out as well.

[Ron Mexico]

IMO Shipley will be #2. He'll have the second most targets at WR behind AJ. And imo in our 2 WR sets it will be him and AJ and Ship will move into the slot when we go 3 wide.

Agreed all around! Shipley is really the only one other than A.J. that we know all too much about. Providing that he comes back from the injury 100%, I see no reason to think that anyone else will be the #2.

[old man]

It would be better if it were a tough decision because of a deep pool of quality proven players. But I guess a deep pool of unproven potential is likely to turn out at least one or two gems.

Wasn't A J Green a rookie last year? He'looked great on tape, we had highlight film everyware. My point is this, A J was UNPROVEN in the NFL and got he's shot and he became a star. Because of what he did last year, he won't just get the best D B the other team has, He'll have most of them. He's going to be covered like a blanket. He's going to make plenty of catches. He's also going to talk a lot more shots Things around here are changing. There is some very good talent in this pool. Since training camp is here i town, it might be nice to watch a couple to form one's own opion. There'll be some very hard cuts this year. And I got a nickel,5 cents, that says Charles has Greshams job by 6 game.

[OSUfan]

Wasn't A J Green a rookie last year? He'looked great on tape, we had highlight film everyware. My point is this, A J was UNPROVEN in the NFL and got he's shot and he became a star. Because of what he did last year, he won't just get the best D B the other team has, He'll have most of them. He's going to be covered like a blanket. He's going to make plenty of catches. He's also going to talk a lot more shots Things around here are changing. There is some very good talent in this pool. Since training camp is here i town, it might be nice to watch a couple to form one's own opion. There'll be some very hard cuts this year. And I got a nickel,5 cents, that says Charles has Greshams job by 6 game.

I was with you right up to the Charles / Gresham statement. Taking nothing away from Charles but Gresham is a special athlete at his position and has the ability to be one of the all around TEs in the game right now.

[OSUfan]

IMO Shipley will be #2. He'll have the second most targets at WR behind AJ. And imo in our 2 WR sets it will be him and AJ and Ship will move into the slot when we go 3 wide.

Agreed all around! Shipley is really the only one other than A.J. that we know all too much about. Providing that he comes back from the injury 100%, I see no reason to think that anyone else will be the #2.

I think Shipley is a great young receiver. With that said....he will not be the #2 for this team. His niche is the slot. Sanu or Jones will win the #2 spot thru camp performance. Just my opinion but I just do not see Shipley in the role.

[bizi]

Wasn't A J Green a rookie last year? He'looked great on tape, we had highlight film everyware. My point is this, A J was UNPROVEN in the NFL and got he's shot and he became a star. Because of what he did last year, he won't just get the best D B the other team has, He'll have most of them. He's going to be covered like a blanket. He's going to make plenty of catches. He's also going to talk a lot more shots Things around here are changing. There is some very good talent in this pool. Since training camp is here i town, it might be nice to watch a couple to form one's own opion. There'll be some very hard cuts this year. And I got a nickel,5 cents, that says Charles has Greshams job by 6 game.

I'm sorry, but rookie WRs usually do not come in and make an instant impact. AJ doing so speaks more of what a fantastic talent he individually is. I see Tate making the team, but actually am hoping not. I would rather have Pacman in a heartbeat return punts and kick, and feel several of our other options at WR have more potential. This is now his 4th year in the league. If he was gonna make an impact at WR, he should have done it by now. Shipley may play slot, but he's our most reliable option behind Green if he recovers from injury in time and likely #2. If someone takes the #2 spot from, it will be due to a great training camp, and I'll have no problem with that. Our history has shown we tend to choose a reliable option before throwing a rookie/newbie into the fold.

[Slappy from New Haven]

You gotta figure Green, Sanu, and Shipley are all guaranteed a roster spot, so that leaves 3 open spots.

These are the guys competing:
Jones
Binns
Whalen
Hawkins
Hazelton
Tate
Moore
Hilton
Rogers

-Binns has impressed in camp
-Jones shows Chad Johnson-like receiving qualities
-Hawkins is a great gadget guy/back-up slot receiver
-Tate is the most veteran guy on the receiver corp
-Whalen looked ok when given a chance last season

So really, I think it comes down to these 5 guys, barring one of the CFAs blowing it up.

why is sanu guaranteed a spot? What has he ever done in the NFL

[bizi]

why is sanu guaranteed a spot? What has he ever done in the NFL

But then you could say that argument about every single draft pick including Andrew Luck and RG3. Do you really think both those players could be cut? I think the statement is based more on when he was drafted and his significant collegiate production.

[Shake n Blake]

why is sanu guaranteed a spot? What has he ever done in the NFL

He was a 3rd round pick.

3rd round picks don't get released before they play a snap. It just doesn't happen. Unless Sanu punches a coach or a cop, he's safe.

[Ron Mexico]

I think Shipley is a great young receiver. With that said....he will not be the #2 for this team. His niche is the slot. Sanu or Jones will win the #2 spot thru camp performance. Just my opinion but I just do not see Shipley in the role.

I agree that Shipley is better suited for the slot position, but from what I've seen and read....so is Sanu. I don't think that any spot other than A.J.'s is really guaranteed for this upcoming season, but if no one really stands out in training camp and the preseason as the best option for the #2 spot, I would think that Shipley will get some looks for it.

[palmer_garnett_95]

I would not be surprised if they don't try to find a way to keep 7 WRs with all of the talent among our WRs. That or try to pull a Chad/Rivers trade and get a pick for someone like Shipley(that's if Sanu/Whalen outplay him).

Right now, it's hard to say who will end up on the team. I feel like AJ, Shipley, Jones, and Sanu are likely locks, maybe Binns if he continues to play as well as he has. Whalen is like a bigger version of Shipley, with maybe a little less polish. Hawk is great for gadget plays, and also came up with a few big plays down the stretch last year when Simpson and Caldwell weren't stepping up. I feel like Tate should have the talent to come out and be our #2 guy, but I don't know if he's going to do it or not.

I think if Tate doesn't step it up, and they find a good substitute at returner(Hawk, Jones, Shipley, A.Jones, Sanu), then he becomes the odd man out. The reason being that his only benefit to the team is as a returner. The question is if they only keep 6 or go light somewhere else so they can keep 7 WRs.

[OSUfan]

I agree that Shipley is better suited for the slot position, but from what I've seen and read....so is Sanu. I don't think that any spot other than A.J.'s is really guaranteed for this upcoming season, but if no one really stands out in training camp and the preseason as the best option for the #2 spot, I would think that Shipley will get some looks for it.

I think there is a misconception about Sanu and the slot. He played out of the slot at Rutgers because the slot was the primary in most of their offensive sets. Prior to this he played the prototypical outside position.

[Bryan]

I think Shipley is a great young receiver. With that said....he will not be the #2 for this team. His niche is the slot. Sanu or Jones will win the #2 spot thru camp performance. Just my opinion but I just do not see Shipley in the role.
#2 receiver means he has the second most targets. Not necessarily the Y spot across from AJ's X. However he did play both the slot and out wide in college. I don't want to keep using the Welker comparison because it's a little tired but he compares best to him. In the Pats 2 WR sets Welker is on the outside with Branch across from him and in their 3 wide sets he moves into the slot. I see no reason why can't do that here with Jordan.

[Ron Mexico]

I think there is a misconception about Sanu and the slot. He played out of the slot at Rutgers because the slot was the primary in most of their offensive sets. Prior to this he played the prototypical outside position.

This is the first I've heard of it. All I've seen or heard before this regarded him as a slot receiver. As Bryan said below me though, if Shipley turns out to be the second best receiving option on the team, wouldn't you want him to line out wide in 2 receiver sets? I mean,...the best players being on the field, and creating mis-matches helps win games right? I don't know if Shipley could work out as well as a number 2, but if he performs the best, I see no reason to not award that play with more playing time.

Honestly,...I hope we're still having this discussion in a few months, as it would likely mean that both players are playing really well, and deserve it.

[shaolinghost]

What is the special teams outlook for these guys? Can any return kicks/punts besides Tate?

Shipley, and Sanu I know returned kicks and punts with some success in the NCAA, so they might get a look in that area. The others I'm not really sure.

[sled21]

I suspect Binns will be this years surprise weapon. (not saying better than Sanu, just more unexpected) From what I read of him on the practice each week he was to play a different receiver, he ran their routes perfect. How can that time not make him into a better receiver himself....

[yellowxdiscipline]

I think we'll know by the end of preseason who the number 2 is, but id say that Binns has the leg up over all others at this point.

[Skyblade]

Wasn't A J Green a rookie last year? He'looked great on tape, we had highlight film everyware. My point is this, A J was UNPROVEN in the NFL and got he's shot and he became a star. Because of what he did last year, he won't just get the best D B the other team has, He'll have most of them. He's going to be covered like a blanket. He's going to make plenty of catches. He's also going to talk a lot more shots Things around here are changing. There is some very good talent in this pool. Since training camp is here i town, it might be nice to watch a couple to form one's own opion. There'll be some very hard cuts this year. And I got a nickel,5 cents, that says Charles has Greshams job by 6 game.
A.J. Green was the #4 overall pick, he was rated so highly because of the expectation that he could immediately step in and be a starter from day 1.

If teams thought the same of Sanu, he would have been long gone by the third round. This is not to say Sanu can't become a starter in the future, but I'm very doubtful it will be from day 1 (or if he does that he will do well). There is a huge difference between early first round pick (#1 WR taken) and mid third round pick (11th or 12th WR taken).

Sanu will presumably make the team (although 3rd round picks don't always, but probably less then 1% fail to make the opening day roster). But I think Shipley, Whalen, Hawkins and Binns will probably see the most time on the field (besides Green) this year.

[corpjet]

The NFL is all about depth, the more quality players the merrier!

Worse case we trade excess for draft picks or areas of need.

[mulligan]

This is the first I've heard of it. All I've seen or heard before this regarded him as a slot receiver. As Bryan said below me though, if Shipley turns out to be the second best receiving option on the team, wouldn't you want him to line out wide in 2 receiver sets? I mean,...the best players being on the field, and creating mis-matches helps win games right? I don't know if Shipley could work out as well as a number 2, but if he performs the best, I see no reason to not award that play with more playing time.

Honestly,...I hope we're still having this discussion in a few months, as it would likely mean that both players are playing really well, and deserve it.

Read up on Sanu if you haven't already.

6'2" 210 lbs. High school QB. Recruited to play Safety at Rutgers. 3 year starting WR at Rutgers. The first 2 years, he played outside receiver (both positions). In 3rd year, there wasn't a slot receiver, so he played in the slot. He caught 70% of the completions at Rutgers his last (3rd) year. Excellent route runner and great hands.

Sanu has the intelligence to play all 3 WR slots in the NFL; very versatile in this way.

Gruden is not about pigeon-holing a receiver to a certain spot. "Unfortunately", both Chad & Simpson were locked into just 1 WR role because they lacked the capacity to learn and perform different roles.

If Shipley (6'0" 188 lbs) and/or Jones (6'2" 200 lbs) can also learn all 3 WR roles, Gruden is going to have a field day mixing and matching the WR to create mis-matches moving Green (6'4" 207 lbs), Sanu, and Shipley/Jones all around the field.

[mulligan]

A.J. Green was the #4 overall pick, he was rated so highly because of the expectation that he could immediately step in and be a starter from day 1.

If teams thought the same of Sanu, he would have been long gone by the third round. This is not to say Sanu can't become a starter in the future, but I'm very doubtful it will be from day 1 (or if he does that he will do well). There is a huge difference between early first round pick (#1 WR taken) and mid third round pick (11th or 12th WR taken).

Sanu will presumably make the team (although 3rd round picks don't always, but probably less then 1% fail to make the opening day roster). But I think Shipley, Whalen, Hawkins and Binns will probably see the most time on the field (besides Green) this year.

Shipley (3rd rounder, 84th overall) was able to start from day 1 and tied Gresham for most catches by an NFL rookie in 2010.
Sanu (3rd rounder, 83rd overall) may be able to do something similar.

[McC]

Wasn't A J Green a rookie last year? He'looked great on tape, we had highlight film everyware. My point is this, A J was UNPROVEN in the NFL and got he's shot and he became a star. Because of what he did last year, he won't just get the best D B the other team has, He'll have most of them. He's going to be covered like a blanket. He's going to make plenty of catches. He's also going to talk a lot more shots Things around here are changing. There is some very good talent in this pool. Since training camp is here i town, it might be nice to watch a couple to form one's own opion. There'll be some very hard cuts this year. And I got a nickel,5 cents, that says Charles has Greshams job by 6 game.

You had me right up until you said this. I don't see this happening because I don't see him even given the chance to take Gresh's job. Plus, Gresh will be doing a very fine job of doing Gresh's job. Charles will have his own job to do and anything good he does will just make for a better team. It won't be either or, it'll be both.

[Shouldamapads]

I have a feeling the WR is far from being decided. Don't be surprised if a vet is picked up along the way when rosters are being decided. Jones and Rogers are pretty damn good in their own right and it will be interesting to see who prevails.

[berserkerone88]

Obviously Green is locked in at #1.
Shipley should be locked in at slot if healthy.

[sidebar: would anyone be that surprised to see Ship cut if his knee isnt 100%?
I dont think it will, but it very well could happen]

Sanu is the next closest to a lock.
I think Hawkins makes it for the skill set he brings.

That is 4.
Binns, Jones, Whalen and Tate fight it out for 5 and if two really shine, maybe we do keep six.

But I think it will come down to one thing: SPECIAL TEAMS.
Jones has been returning I think at camp.
Whalen can play ST.
Tate is our only real return man.
Binns, can he play ST?

Your 5th/6th WR has to return or play ST. Otherwise, why keep them?