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Old 02-14-2010, 05:04 AM
johnnies1515 johnnies1515 is offline
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bengals Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

I still like the idea that we trade our 1st and 4th for Chris Cooley and Skins 2nd and 4th, essentially moving down 15 picks for Cooley. Some1 presented me with the trade value chart or somethin and said the #'s worked out that cooley would be valued at a mid-late third rd. pick in that scenario which might be a litttle cheap for him but if you consider all the circumstances (Cooley is i believe 27-28 now, he's coming off one of the toughest injury's to recover from and the skins have one of the best young TE's in the game) and if no1 else bites on cooley b4 that draft if i'm the skins GM i look long and hard at that one, and hell if we had to throw in an extra 6th this year or 5th next i'd still do it. Here's my mock if we pulled the deal off. (using mix of drafttek.com, nfldraftscout.com, and mayocks ratings mostly as reference)

(37) Taylor Mays S USC- This one all depends on his 40x apparently. I don't think he will be available but most of the draft scouts think he will so who am i to argue. I still think he's a freak even if he doesn't run in the 4.3's (which he isn't for all you that are drinking the cool-aid) He's still an incredible speciman if he runs the 4.45 i expect him to.

(54) Dexter McCluster RB/WR Ole Miss- I find it very very hard to believe that this kid is going to fall to the 3rd rd. After the college season was over i thought he was a 1st rd lock. Ya he's 5"8 170 but the kid is a flat-out game changer, and game changer's win you football games. He will obv. start out running routes if we sign ced benson which i fully expect we will and would be pretty dissapointed if we didn't, but back to Dex he could also instantly help us in the KO/PR game. I think he can be very similer to reggie bush or less bulky darren sproles. Anyway if you don't agree with this kid or think it's a reach just pop the tape in, i could go on forever bout this kid but can't (or at least don't feel like it lol)

(84) Lammar Houston DT UT- Like the kid on tape playing against some pretty good competition. Not a 3 down guy because he lacks the size needed to play the run in the NFL thus the reason he's available in the 3rd rd. He actually reminds me a lot of a younger tank johnson but not quite as thick.

(100) Jordan Shipley WR UT- PSU fan really hate every other power house except them just in case ya thought i was a homer lol but back to jordan. He's a great ATH who could prob help us right away in the passing game and deff in the return game. He was good size and speed with a great set of hands on him, and ya gotta love a kid with the kid with this kind of work ethic (i think that factor alone will prob lead to him being drafted a bit earlier but not much, also depends on his 40x as it does with most skill players)

(C) late 4th rd. Zane Beadles OG Utah- Don't know a ton about beadles (good ole lineman never get the credit they deserve lol) but he had a decent showing at the senior bowl against some of the best. He's quicker and faster then John Jerry and Brandon Carter the other two players who i would look at with this pick so i'm gunna give him the nod. I like a Guard who can get out in front on those counters and tosses and put a lick on some poor CB or S lol.

(148) Myron Rolle SS FSU- Pretty much a semi-need/BPA pick. Only had 1 interception in 33 games at FSU do to a ****ty scheme, was rarely put in position to make plays. Lot of question marks surrouning Rolle at this point but i believe he overcomes most of them. I know i already drafted a S with the 1st pick but the fact of the matter is both of our Saftey's are pretty old and i wouldn't mind having a player with this kind of talent to push our Strong Safteys. I figure Crocker would be safe at FS and Mays could platoon with roy this year and in 2011 Mays can move to FS and have Myron pushing Roy or Ndukwe for the starting SS spot ( prob Ndukwe i don't see roy being very affective for much longer)

(181) Lindsey Witten DE/OLB Uconn- OLB is college but expects to play DE in the pro's. Plays fast and nice prospect overall, a little bit of a tweener but can add some bulk while developing. Has talent and overall ability to play if it came down to it but deff more of a project pick (not easy to find NFL ready guys in the 6th rd)

(212) AJ Wallace CB PSU- Alright going with oneeeeee homer pick thats it, and it's a seventh rounder so cut me some slack lol This pick would be a BPA pick between CB/RB i think every other need was covered. Wallace was one of the best corner prospects coming out of high school and showed why at PSU. He didn't make a ton of big plays being a secondary player at a big ten school but also didn't give up a lot of big plays. Big physical kid who can push trent for nickel but most likely will end up in the dime package and some special teams.


Let's get a petition signed by like 20,000 people and get it to the bengals GM. So who's with me???

O ya he's the skins 1st 3 picks just for the hell of it.

(4.) Russell Okung OT Ok St.- Awsome Prosect, not going to go into detail bout a OT you know what they do (rape and pillage) lol

(21) Jimmy Clausen QB Notre Dame- Could be a solid NFL type, maybe not a perrenial pro-bowler but ya just never know QB deff a hard positon to project. Played under weis a good QB coach and his actually QB coach Ron Powlus a.k.a. the biggest flop in recruiting history (thanks to beano cook projecting a heisman his freshman year and 2 overall) is my boy lol naw he just went to the same high school as me but he's a pretty good coach but had misfortune of being on weis's staff this offseason.

(117) Toby Gerhart RB Stan- Another guy that looked pretty darn good on tape and has the #'s to prove it (should of won heisman) but most games were against inferior defenses. But i don't think he had a bad game all year so either way the kid can play. Combine will determine if he's a 3rd rd pick or a 4th-5th rounder. Overall tho hard not to like'em.

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Old 02-14-2010, 06:51 AM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

:joe:
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Old 02-14-2010, 09:20 AM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

I'd love trading for Cooley because the dude can play but I dont know if the Skins would be willing to ship one of their best players off. As far as the draft I'm really not a fan of Taylor Mays so that make's me . would rather see nate allen or morgan burnett there. Love Dex. and Houston.
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Old 02-14-2010, 10:07 AM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

Not bad overall. The Cooley trade wouldn't bother me, he has been productive.

2. Don't see Mays falling this far; I'd be stoked if we got him at this point though.

2. Don't really see McCluster as a fit in a Brat offense. I don't think he'd use him well, plus we don't really need a scat back, but as a slot receiver he could be valuable.

3. Houston would be a great addition, but he's a guy that I think moves into 2 when all the dust settles.

3. Shipley could be a great slot guy, I wouldn't hate the pick.

4. Beadles would be a solid pickup since he can play several spots.

5. Don't really see why we need 2 safeties with Crock only entering year two of a four year deal. I like Rolle, but we would be better served with a CB and I really don't see Rolle falling to 5 assuming he has a solid combine.

6. Decent pick. Would most likely be a PS guy.

7. Athletically Wallace would be a great pick. I wouldn't mind seeing if he could be developed on the PS.
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Old 02-14-2010, 01:16 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

We add two guys who will max out as slot guys?
I think Shipley will be a great slot receiver but I dont think he will be much more than that.
McCluster is just a bad fit here.
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Old 02-14-2010, 01:33 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

If 20,000 people signed on for this I would have a very sore hand from slapping them all upside the head.

We take 2 slot guys and 2 strong safeties?

Nevermind that horrible outcome, why would the Redskins be interested in this? They lose their starting tight end, and one of the first 100 picks in a deep draft in which they need tons of help.
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Old 02-14-2010, 02:03 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

There is no reason to trade a first round pick unless you are getting someone with the talent of:

Brandon Marshall
Andre Johnson
Julius Peppers
Vince Wilfork
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Old 02-14-2010, 04:45 PM
johnnies1515 johnnies1515 is offline
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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I'd love trading for Cooley because the dude can play but I dont know if the Skins would be willing to ship one of their best players off. As far as the draft I'm really not a fan of Taylor Mays so that make's me . would rather see nate allen or morgan burnett there. Love Dex. and Houston.
Even if he's one of there best players he's still the 2nd best TE on the team next year. If u were a GM and you had a rookie TE who had as good a year as anyone not named dallas clark making 500k for the next 2-3 years and some1 offered you a third and 6th rounder for your back-up who is making (not sure what cooleys making prob between 4-6 million and i believe they have'em locked up for 3-4 more years) u wouldn't pull that deal off?

I hate a lot of players esp. players from USC but once there a bengal or can help us that all changes. Leave ur hate and bias at the door if we could get him in that situation u would have to be pretty stoked bro.
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Old 02-14-2010, 04:59 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

I'd love to have Cooley, but I doubt it could happen.
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:02 PM
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bengals Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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Not bad overall. The Cooley trade wouldn't bother me, he has been productive.

2. Don't see Mays falling this far; I'd be stoked if we got him at this point though.

2. Don't really see McCluster as a fit in a Brat offense. I don't think he'd use him well, plus we don't really need a scat back, but as a slot receiver he could be valuable.

3. Houston would be a great addition, but he's a guy that I think moves into 2 when all the dust settles.

3. Shipley could be a great slot guy, I wouldn't hate the pick.

4. Beadles would be a solid pickup since he can play several spots.

5. Don't really see why we need 2 safeties with Crock only entering year two of a four year deal. I like Rolle, but we would be better served with a CB and I really don't see Rolle falling to 5 assuming he has a solid combine.

6. Decent pick. Would most likely be a PS guy.

7. Athletically Wallace would be a great pick. I wouldn't mind seeing if he could be developed on the PS.
I don't think we can look at a player like Dex and say he won't fit in our OC's offense. OC's have to be flexable now a days, if your passing on a player cuz he doesn't fit your OC's scheme you need a new OC. I know were a run 1st team now but anytime you can get a player with the skill set of a reggie bush in the 2nd rd you gotta take a long hard look at it. This kid is a flat out GAME CHANGER, throw'em a hitch here, and smoke screen there, a couple tosses or perimeter run plays and let him return every KO/PR he can get his hands on. I don't think you should change a scheme for 1 player but this kid is an OC's dream quite frankly.

In my opinion Shipley has the speed and ability to play on the outside. I think he can get good enuf seperation to play on the outside but i guess we'll just have to see. Kids got tremendous hands and his work ethic is 2nd to none so i would be surprised if he's there but he fit this draft well i thought. I'm thinking the jones signing will allow us to use our 1st 2 picks elsewhere (unless dez falls which is unlikely but ya never know he's deff overrated) But in that case we would surely have to spend a 1st or 2nd next year on WR.

I was unaware that crocker was signed to a 4 year deal. I didn't think we would be signing an average 29 year old saftey to a 4 year deal but who knows i was pleasantly surprised with his play last year. And the rolle pick was pretty much a BPA pick on a 2-3 year plan. I thought the prior picks afforded me the ability to take him since we shored up our major needs. I figure he would come in right away and help on special teams and give us a hell of an option at SS in a year or 2 when Mays moves back to free. I don't really expect Rolle to wow anyone at the combine also he's expected to run in the 4.6 4.7 range which is pretty slow for a guy expected to run with NFL WR's. The year off also didn't help, and the fact that he only had 1 pick in 33 college games isn't really helping him. He's living off his reputation in high school where he was one of the top recruits in the last 10 years. But i agree he could be a pretty solid NFL SS and prob will go in the late 3rd early 4th but i'm just going by what all the NFL scouts and analyst's are saying i mean who am i to argue with them lol
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:03 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

I can't see the Redskins trading arguably the most popular player on the team. The fans are pretty upset already.
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:08 PM
johnnies1515 johnnies1515 is offline
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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If 20,000 people signed on for this I would have a very sore hand from slapping them all upside the head.

We take 2 slot guys and 2 strong safeties?

Nevermind that horrible outcome, why would the Redskins be interested in this? They lose their starting tight end, and one of the first 100 picks in a deep draft in which they need tons of help.
I have Shipley playing on the outside and Taylor will be more valuble at FS in the NFL.

It will allow us to get cooley and still prob have half the targets we were looking at in the 21 spot still on the board at 36

Why would the skins be interested in unloading a big contract on a player coming off ACL surgery who will prob be in a back-up role next year you ask? Well besides that it would allow them to take the top tackle in the draft and have an anchor on protecting the blind side of the QB they will be able to draft w/out overdrafting the crap out of a sam bradford (although i like sam think he'll be a quality starter but if you can get Jimmy Clausen at 21? no brainer....) not to mention they will be saving 20,000,000 off the top of the contract, not that snyder cares tho lol

That would be your horrible outcome....ouch that would sink both teams for at least 3-5 years right?

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Old 02-14-2010, 05:14 PM
johnnies1515 johnnies1515 is offline
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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I can't see the Redskins trading arguably the most popular player on the team. The fans are pretty upset already.
NFL is a business now a days Owners and GM's aren't really caring much about what the fans think it's all about what's best for the team at present time and long run and i just think this scenario makes a lot of sense for both teams but it's just an opinion (we all got'em and they usually stink! lol)
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:16 PM
johnnies1515 johnnies1515 is offline
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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There is no reason to trade a first round pick unless you are getting someone with the talent of:

Brandon Marshall
Andre Johnson
Julius Peppers
Vince Wilfork
If we traded our #1 pick in this scenario and moved down 16 spots for cooley,who are we targeting other then thomas that you can say DEFF 100% won't be there at 36? Jeez i'm really getting my post count up today
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Old 02-15-2010, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

I'd be very happy with the deal. It would benefit the Skins to land a T or BPA at their pick and still get a QB at the 21 pick or even later if they don't value one enough to be the 4 pick. I'm not on the same page with the mock (Bech was spot on about the top picks), but I'd be happy to see them land a vet that can be a red zone threat and still block...PLUS still have a value pick at 37. Give me Cooley, T.O., M.Jones and there are a lot of weapons for Carson to play with.
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Old 02-15-2010, 09:26 AM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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I have Shipley playing on the outside and Taylor will be more valuble at FS in the NFL.

It will allow us to get cooley and still prob have half the targets we were looking at in the 21 spot still on the board at 36

Why would the skins be interested in unloading a big contract on a player coming off ACL surgery who will prob be in a back-up role next year you ask? Well besides that it would allow them to take the top tackle in the draft and have an anchor on protecting the blind side of the QB they will be able to draft w/out overdrafting the crap out of a sam bradford (although i like sam think he'll be a quality starter but if you can get Jimmy Clausen at 21? no brainer....) not to mention they will be saving 20,000,000 off the top of the contract, not that snyder cares tho lol

That would be your horrible outcome....ouch that would sink both teams for at least 3-5 years right?

The biggest part of Cooley's contract has already been paid. An 11 million dollar roster bonus paid in 2009. Outside of that bonus he is set to make 2.3 million this next year. How is that unloading a big contract?


Plus, Shipley is too small and can't get off the jam to play on the outside, and Mays doesn't have the coverage skills needed to play FS in our scheme.

And you never addressed how it is beneficial for a team who needs all the players they can get to lose one of the top 100 players in this draft...
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Old 02-15-2010, 03:57 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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The biggest part of Cooley's contract has already been paid. An 11 million dollar roster bonus paid in 2009. Outside of that bonus he is set to make 2.3 million this next year. How is that unloading a big contract?


Plus, Shipley is too small and can't get off the jam to play on the outside, and Mays doesn't have the coverage skills needed to play FS in our scheme.

And you never addressed how it is beneficial for a team who needs all the players they can get to lose one of the top 100 players in this draft...
Ya shipley's not big but he's deff not small 6-0 190. I think he is best suited for playing the slot in the NFL but i think he was the skills to play on the outside a couple plays a game....

Cooley's cap # towerd 2010 would be about 4.8 million which is 8th highest on the team, and generally a TE in not in a teams top 15 salaries ( a team that has the 2nd highest payroll in league) so ya i would say it's pretty substancial cap relief. Also the 4th highest paid TE in league based on the 2009 NFA salary report http://www.thenfa.com/pdfs/salaries/nfa2009_saltest.pdf

Mays is a pretty good cover guy he just had some trouble his senior year becuase the USC defense was not as stout up front as it usually is. He is always in good position which is half the battle at FS and has great recovery speed. I think he will be best suited for SS his rookie year and maybe soph but i think he will slowly grow the skills needed to transition to FS.

The Redskins are a pretty good team on paper. Everyone thought they were going to be pushing for a playoff spot preseason. I guess they will be in a semi rebuilding stage this year but i think it is super beneficial for them if they can land the QB they want without having to overdraft him by 17 picks (clausen and bradford are pretty much 1 and 1A in QB rankings). They get the Tackle they need they also get the QB they covet and still have a 3rd rounder to push for a starting job at another position i mean were not talking about the rams or lions the skins aren't that bad are they? Cambell will start either way next year and if the can get Okung to protect him they may be able to push for an 9-7 season.

Last edited by johnnies1515; 02-15-2010 at 04:00 PM.
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Old 02-15-2010, 08:10 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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If 20,000 people signed on for this I would have a very sore hand from slapping them all upside the head.

.
This made me laugh...

The only part of the mock that struck my interest was getting Cooley and I'm not totally sold that he would flourish in this O. But if the skins are willing to give him up just to move up 14 spots then I wouldn't mind. Plus we would not have to worry about a 1st round holdout.
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Old 02-20-2010, 06:42 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

LOVE IT!!!

Big Cooley fan and he can play H-back or Fullback...he would be a great pick up
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Old 02-20-2010, 08:13 PM
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LOVE IT!!!

Big Cooley fan and he can play H-back or Fullback...he would be a great pick up
Why cant people play their normal positions?

I like Cooley but that mock kinda ******.
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Old 02-23-2010, 06:26 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

Where in the world do people get their idea of trade value from?

a 1st and a 4th?

Cooley is a great TE and it actually has been mentioned by some talking heads that with Fred Davis emerging that they might move Cooley to save some money and get more picks for the rebuild.

but honestly you could most likely get him for a 3rd rounder.

TEs are not historically known for having insane trade value.
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Old 02-23-2010, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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LOVE IT!!!

Big Cooley fan and he can play H-back or Fullback...he would be a great pick up
ummmm Cooley and Clark are mentioned in the same sentence... small and not strong enough to consistently block... Excellent recievers that play mostly split out

1. I have no doubts Coffman could be productive in the same way they are used

2. We don't use that type of TE in our offense... we use in-line

3. Whats the point in all the trading for Cooley when we could get Gresham in the First or MCCoy, Gronwski in the Second
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Old 02-24-2010, 12:36 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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ummmm Cooley and Clark are mentioned in the same sentence... small and not strong enough to consistently block... Excellent recievers that play mostly split out

1. I have no doubts Coffman could be productive in the same way they are used

2. We don't use that type of TE in our offense... we use in-line

3. Whats the point in all the trading for Cooley when we could get Gresham in the First or MCCoy, Gronwski in the Second
1. Coffman is unproven. He very well could end up being better than these guys or almost as good, but he is unproven.

2. Cooley played a lot of H-Back at Washington. Your have to be at least a decent blocker to play that position.

3. Once again, you are comparing a unproven rookie to a Pro-Bowler.
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Old 02-24-2010, 01:39 PM
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

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Where in the world do people get their idea of trade value from?

a 1st and a 4th?

Cooley is a great TE and it actually has been mentioned by some talking heads that with Fred Davis emerging that they might move Cooley to save some money and get more picks for the rebuild.

but honestly you could most likely get him for a 3rd rounder.

TEs are not historically known for having insane trade value.
He's not saying to just flat out give the Redskins those two picks....He said that we would give them......

Our 1st (21st overall)
and 4th (117th overall)

For their

2nd (37th overall)
and 4th (100th overall)
plus Chris Cooley

Thats actually a pretty good value. We would be picking up a pretty decent TE, so we wouldn't really have to draft one, and it would only drop us 16 spots. I think we should move out of the first anyway, but I was thinking to trade for additional picks.

I like it.....but it wont happen.
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Old 02-24-2010, 01:41 PM
Jay Dolla Jay Dolla is offline
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Default Re: Trade for Cooley? (finally get to thread!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalBoy View Post
1. Coffman is unproven. He very well could end up being better than these guys or almost as good, but he is unproven.

2. Cooley played a lot of H-Back at Washington. Your have to be at least a decent blocker to play that position.

3. Once again, you are comparing a unproven rookie to a Pro-Bowler.
yeah he was so good at H-back that he's playing that in the NFL....

come one man you know the whole point of it was that Cooley and Coffman are in the same mold and that doesn't make sense to have two of those in our offense, that doesn't even use them at their strength... split out as a WR

seems I touched a nerve talking about Cooley for you... because it clearly wasn't a comparison between the indvidual skills of two players that you twisted it into

Last edited by Jay Dolla; 02-24-2010 at 01:45 PM.
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