Carson Palmer.........Wasted Victories

[bfine32]

Originally Posted by WeezyBengal

I bet 99% of you Palmer haters are also the people that hate the organization and the front office. It just doesnt make sence. If you hate Mike Brown and the organization how can you hate Palmer for what he did?

Palmer left the organization because it *****. We know it, he knows it, everyone knows it. I think what he did was great. It embarrassed the organization nationally. How bad must your place of employment be if you walk away from 50 million dollars?

However, according to reports he didn't leave because of the organization; he left because of the fans. I find enough room in my heart to be a fan of neither CP9 nor MB.

[shaolinghost]

Originally Posted by BobJones4980

Dalton is 13-12 regular season, 13-13 counting playoffs so how is it a fact that Dalton has a losing record? Not to mention that one playoff loss was in his rookie season and were only half way through his second.

The point is Dalton has not proven to be a leader. He has leadership qualities, but he hasn't shown the ability to lead an NFL team to anything of importance.

Originally Posted by BobJones4980

Is this a joke man? Im hoping your forgot the sarcasm tag or something because if you are really so delusional you don't think he quit on this team your an idiot, He said trade me or ill retire correct? So how is that not quitting ?

Not at all. Looking at things entirely in black and white that's what happened.
Palmer said he wanted a trade. If he didn't get that trade, he was going to retire(this is 100% legal). After what is considered a hold-out(didn't report, and accrued fines), he was traded. Just because what he was holding out for wasn't extra monetary compensation doesn't make it any different.

If he quit he would no longer be playing football.

Also, what I think is delusional, are the people swearing up and down that what Palmer did wasn't a career decision, but a decision made because he's a pansy that can't take criticism, or doesn't like contact. He's stated on more than one occasion that he had no problems with the fans or any of his teammates, and certainly wasn't mad enough about any incidents related to overzealous fans that it would cause him to want to leave the team. He simply didn't want to play for an owner whose main focus wasn't winning, and a coach who was retained after 2 4win seasons in 3 years.

[hailroad]

Originally Posted by bfine32

However, according to reports he didn't leave because of the organization; he left because of the fans. I find enough room in my heart to be a fan of neither CP9 nor MB.

Looking for the link, but I am pretty sure it was in a Peter King MMQB where he flat stated it was "the owner" and not coaches, players, or fans.

[hailroad]

Originally Posted by OSUfan

Thanking you for making my case. You read the transcript. Right before where you can read the transcript is the video of each press conference. Try that option.

Just to hammer the point home, here is a blog post on our very own bengals.com where the author and Boomer get it too. Apparently, you didn't get that memo:

http://blogs.bengals.com/2012/11/08/...nd-leadership/

[Lygraf]

Originally Posted by shaolinghost

The point is Dalton has not proven to be a leader. He has leadership qualities, but he hasn't shown the ability to lead an NFL team to anything of importance.

4 TDs against the defending champs is nothing of importance? Huh?

[Shake n Blake]

I love how people talk like Dalton needs to step up and get in people's faces and be a leader like Drew Brees or Tom Brady. Thing is, those guys didn't become leaders until they had rings or significant success. Mike Brown and Marvin Lewis need to build a team strong enough to have some real success, THEN they can ask guys like Dalton to step into a leadership role. Until then, no one is going to truly respect a guy who hasn't even won a playoff game in this league.

[BobJones4980]

Originally Posted by shaolinghost

The point is Dalton has not proven to be a leader. He has leadership qualities, but he hasn't shown the ability to lead an NFL team to anything of importance.



Not at all. Looking at things entirely in black and white that's what happened.
Palmer said he wanted a trade. If he didn't get that trade, he was going to retire(this is 100% legal). After what is considered a hold-out(didn't report, and accrued fines), he was traded. Just because what he was holding out for wasn't extra monetary compensation doesn't make it any different.

If he quit he would no longer be playing football.

Also, what I think is delusional, are the people swearing up and down that what Palmer did wasn't a career decision, but a decision made because he's a pansy that can't take criticism, or doesn't like contact. He's stated on more than one occasion that he had no problems with the fans or any of his teammates, and certainly wasn't mad enough about any incidents related to overzealous fans that it would cause him to want to leave the team. He simply didn't want to play for an owner whose main focus wasn't winning, and a coach who was retained after 2 4win seasons in 3 years.

When you walk out on your team and say trade me or I retire that is quitting. I didnt say he quit football, I said the guy quit on this team and thats exactly what he did no matter how you wanna spin it.

As for the the last part of what you said, well im sure he will have a great time with the Raiders.

[old man]

Originally Posted by hailroad

No, you just act like it is a simple case of "I quit", or Carson just walked in and said, "I quit". Ever thought for one second why? Of course you didn't.

And yes, read the official transcript instead of putting your "spin" on it. He was calling them out:

Those QBs are obviously very confident in the outcome of the play. Where is Andy Dalton’s confidence this year?
ML: “We're looking for our quarterback and our middle linebacker to take hold of our football team, and I think that's important for us. I think both guys are such good people, that you've got to be a little bit of a (jerk). You do. That's what these guys we're talking about have. That's part of it.

“Andy has a great deal of confidence, self-confidence, internal confidence, confidence in the guys around him. But at some point you step out of your skin and you go. And it's time to go. It's time to step out of our skin, both places, all throughout. We've wallowed around here in mediocrity. Let's go. That's the thing we've got to do. These guys that have it, they've got it and they've done it. And everybody around them, there's got to be a confidence level, too, of anticipation and then clicking on those things.”

Has he shown any sign of doing it?
ML: “We have to really look in the mirror and move forward. That's big for us.”

So if I write that Marvin Lewis says Andy Dalton needs to be more of a (jerk):
ML: “OK (laughs), let's clean it up. We're looking for Andy to take the next step of being the leader of this football team. Confident, vocal if it needs to be, but grab this football team by the back of its neck and let's go. Let's move forward.”

Have you guys talked about that?
ML: “The offensive coaches, yes, have been visiting with him about it all the time. Over this period of time, having looked back at where we are and where we want to go.”

“The two days that New Orleans was here (practicing in Cincinnati in August due to weather problems in New Orleans), I couldn't wait to go out just to watch Drew (Brees). From when he was here before, and to watch Drew now. You know, Drew post-Super Bowl compared to Drew pre-Super Bowl, and how Drew does things.

“And I got to visiting with him on the sidelines, while the defense was working, about that. There's a lot we took from that and shared that with Andy. We've just got to keep pressing that. When you have a good player, you can keep pressing the envelope. We did that with Ray Lewis. Don't go to the Pro Bowl and have a good time, or the Super Bowl and have a good time. You go and you **** the knowledge out of everybody there. When your good, young players have the opportunity to learn from that and be a part of that, then you've got to take advantage of that. And then it spreads throughout the football team. Terence Newman is a guy on defense like that. He's got a lot to offer. Be comfortable with us now, and let's go.”



AJ has done great, but Sanu hasn't gotten on the field until recently and Hawkins has a knack for dissappearing. Either way, Binns was the talk of the offseason and training camp. He didn't exactly light it up when he was playing.

Time to put the C, on his chest.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

Carson who? That is two weeks away, Bengaldom, and he doesn't matter until the Chiefs' game is over and won by the Bengals.

[FRAv]

Originally Posted by shaolinghost

The point is Dalton has not proven to be a leader. He has leadership qualities, but he hasn't shown the ability to lead an NFL team to anything of importance.

Except the playoffs in a pro-bowl rookie season. Forgotten that already?

[tmangoud]

This has NOTHING to do with Dalton, Marvin, Perkins, the man on the moon, yadda yadda yadda.

This is Carson being the man he is and refusing to allow Mike Brown to interfere with his life. Both personally and professionally.

Carson has that right.

Carson saved himself.

Carson beat this delusional old man who's done so much damage to the fans and people of Cincinnati and the residents of Hamilton County who continue to pay the price of Mike Brown living in our community.

In the famous words of ― Nora Ephron
"Above all, be the heroine of your life, not the victim.”


Carson is no longer a victim to Mike Brown. I wish this community could say the same thing.

[shaolinghost]

Originally Posted by Lygraf

4 TDs against the defending champs is nothing of importance? Huh?

Originally Posted by FRAv

Except the playoffs in a pro-bowl rookie season. Forgotten that already?

Those are great personal accomplishments, definitely, but that doesn't directly help a team win a playoff game. Until Dalton wins a playoff game, nobody can definitively say he's a better leader than Palmer was.

Palmer had 2 division titles and 2 playoff appearances in his time here. In addition, he was mentioned as being an elite QB in 05-06. Granted, those aren't that great either, but the fact still remains: Dalton hasn't led the team to win anything of significant importance. Not yet.

A playoff appearance, in the grand scheme, isn't important.

[nevergonnachange]

Originally Posted by tmangoud

This has NOTHING to do with Dalton, Marvin, Perkins, the man on the moon, yadda yadda yadda.

This is Carson being the man he is and refusing to allow Mike Brown to interfere with his life. Both personally and professionally.

Carson has that right.

Carson saved himself.

Carson beat this delusional old man who's done so much damage to the fans and people of Cincinnati and the residents of Hamilton County who continue to pay the price of Mike Brown living in our community.

In the famous words of ― Nora Ephron
"Above all, be the heroine of your life, not the victim.”


Carson is no longer a victim to Mike Brown. I wish this community could say the same thing.

So tell me who won?
Tell me who should be looked upon as being right?

Carson--you are MY hero---I hope you beat the hell out of Mike Brown's team!

You had me until that last line. I despise Mikey Boy with the best of them but if the day ever comes when I'm rooting against the Bengals in a meaningful game; that's the day I find another team to root for.

To be clear: If they're out of playoff contention, I don't root against them, I just don't care.

[tmangoud]

Originally Posted by nevergonnachange

You had me until that last line. I despise Mikey Boy with the best of them but if the day ever comes when I'm rooting against the Bengals in a meaningful game; that's the day I find another team to root for.

To be clear: If they're out of playoff contention, I don't root against them, I just don't care.

Meaninful game ?
We lose EVERY possible tie breaker.
We would have to finish a full game in front of every other team.
These teams play each other---someone has to win.
We went six weeks without a win.

I got news for you--this is a meaningless game.

I agree--if the Bengals had a decent team and the chance to play after the regular season was over---there's no way I would want my Bengals to lose. But this season is OVER. The defensive secondary--the running game. The O-line--...is TERRIBLE. This team could easily finish LAST in their division.

A brick doesn't have to fall on my head. This team is a long long way from competing for a play-off spot.

[Helldog]

Originally Posted by tmangoud

Meaninful game ?
We lose EVERY possible tie breaker.
We would have to finish a full game in front of every other team.
These teams play each other---someone has to win.
We went six weeks without a win.

I got news for you--this is a meaningless game.

I agree--if the Bengals had a decent team and the chance to play after the regular season was over---there's no way I would want my Bengals to lose. But this season is OVER. The defensive secondary--the running game. The O-line--...is TERRIBLE. This team could easily finish LAST in their division.

A brick doesn't have to fall on my head. This team is a long long way from competing for a play-off spot.

Obvious troll is obvious.

Meaningless game.

[WeezyBengal]

Originally Posted by OSUfan

There are reasons stated within the collective bargaining agreement on why a team can cut a player. These were made in agreement with the players. Thereby actually making it a part of the contract that they freely enter into. So this is one of the weakest argument points that is continually made.

Yes like injury etc.

Point is, if you performance in the NFL isnt up to par, you can be cut.

[WeezyBengal]

Originally Posted by bfine32

However, according to reports he didn't leave because of the organization; he left because of the fans. I find enough room in my heart to be a fan of neither CP9 nor MB.

I would love to see these "reports"

[WeezyBengal]

Originally Posted by Fan_in_Kettering

Carson who? That is two weeks away, Bengaldom, and he doesn't matter until the Chiefs' game is over and won by the Bengals.

We dont play for the Bengals so its really not a problem to look past the Chiefs and talk about Carson coming back to Cincy.

[Wyche'sWarrior]

Originally Posted by McC

The timing--lockout, ring a bell? Hey, man, you're just arguing to argue. Argue with yourself cuz I said what I said and it couldn't have been much clearer and now I'm done with it. You wanna be a this player or that player fan, be my guest. Pardon me if I just go on being a Bengal fan and considering anyone not a Bengal the enemy.

AGAIN.....It was BEFORE the lockout that he decided to LEAVE!!!!!! Gosh almighty!!!!! How dense can y'all be? I even provided a link!!! LMAO! I ain't a fan of anybody but my family, and my teams, but why LIE ABOUT IT? Don't be a liar just cuz you hate Carson! You guys are better than that......

[Wyche'sWarrior]

Originally Posted by OSUfan

Three players and each I believe was part of a 53 man roster. Hmmm......the odds are not in your favor. Let me guess they were the only ones man enough to make a stand. Not to mention Pickens was a turd and the fact that Dillon was the only one of them that had a resemblance to a career after leaving.

Oh horse puckey!!!!! This is the SINGLE biggest farce I have ever read on these boards! LMAO!!! Three????? Three????

1.) Boomer Esiason
2.) Jeff Blake
3.) Takeo Spikes
4.) Corey Dillon
5.) Carson Palmer
6.) Chad Johnson
7.) Carl Pickens
8.) Lee Johnson.........LEE FRICKIN JOHNSON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
9.) Johnathan Jospeh
10.) Bruce Coslet (a coach, nonetheless, and Wyche's O.C. resigned)
......that's the top ten, want me to post up some more disgruntled ex Bengals, or will this suffice?

Don't come on here and outright lie in a thin disguise of an attempt to cover for your hero, Mike Clown.

[McC]

Originally Posted by Wyche'sWarrior

AGAIN.....It was BEFORE the lockout that he decided to LEAVE!!!!!! Gosh almighty!!!!! How dense can y'all be? I even provided a link!!! LMAO! I ain't a fan of anybody but my family, and my teams, but why LIE ABOUT IT? Don't be a liar just cuz you hate Carson! You guys are better than that......

Who cares about when he decided to leave? All that matters is when he left, which was during the lockout. You seem to be the dense one. You can use all the giant letters you want. Doesn't make you any more right or any less of a ****. Please tell me what I lied about. You're gonna call me a liar, you'd better be able to prove it, dbag.

I don't hate Palmer. I'm just done with him. Bulletin--He ain't the superhero you seem to think he is. He's just a guy who deserted his teammates. Anyway, justice has been served. He went from bad to worse. That's not my doing. That's the universe. Argue with the universe cuz you're too stupid for me to waste any more time on.

[Helldog]

I'ma get obese eating all this popcorn through this thread.

[bfine32]

Originally Posted by Wyche'sWarrior

AGAIN.....It was BEFORE the lockout that he decided to LEAVE!!!!!! Gosh almighty!!!!! How dense can y'all be? I even provided a link!!! LMAO! I ain't a fan of anybody but my family, and my teams, but why LIE ABOUT IT? Don't be a liar just cuz you hate Carson! You guys are better than that......

Was Carson Palmer a member of the Bengals during the lock out?

[Wyche'sWarrior]

Originally Posted by bfine32

Was Carson Palmer a member of the Bengals during the lock out?

ONLY because Mike Clown refused the trade......the demand was made in December of 2010, correct? Look, I'm not here to rooty toot toot for Carson Palmer....I'm here to point out what an absolute JOKE Mike Clown is, and I won't stop.

[Wyche'sWarrior]

Originally Posted by McC

Who cares about when he decided to leave? All that matters is when he left, which was during the lockout. You seem to be the dense one. You can use all the giant letters you want. Doesn't make you any more right or any less of a ****. Please tell me what I lied about. You're gonna call me a liar, you'd better be able to prove it, dbag.

I don't hate Palmer. I'm just done with him. Bulletin--He ain't the superhero you seem to think he is. He's just a guy who deserted his teammates. Anyway, justice has been served. He went from bad to worse. That's not my doing. That's the universe. Argue with the universe cuz you're too stupid for me to waste any more time on.

I got your dbag....when you say he quit during the lockout....it's a BOLD FACE LIE....PERIOD. Here's the link, again, you illiterate puke:

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/pos...lly-bengalized



....you claim to be some sort of journalist? Well, surely you know what a dateline is, right? Read it and weep. What you get on here and perpetuate as truth, is a LIE. Which, makes anyone who spreads such mularkey, a LIAR. Get it?

Who cares if it's Carson, Pickens, Blake, Boomer, Big Willie.....who cares? That's not the point! The point is, NUMEROUS players have walked, and they continue to do so. But go ahead and live in Walt Disney fairy tale world....it was just Carson. Get real.


Get off the Mike Clown teat.