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  #1  
Old 11-27-2012, 11:08 PM
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Default Micheal Johnson: My View

Some on here may have seen me say that MJ has been highly overrated on these boards and while I stand by that for the most part I am willing to say this.... Hie performance this year is his own doing... not Dunlap's.... no Geno's.... it is his doing.

There is no way a guy on one end that has 2 sacks on the year had anything to do with a guy on the other end having 8... shut up with that nonsense.

Now onto his contract.

If we can sign him or Andre before free agency great. We can use the franchise tag on the other guy and see what he does next year. If he gets to free agency forget him he is gone. Someone will give him a hefty contract in free agency that will be beyond what he is worth like Antwan Odom the year we signed him. I'm still not that sold on him but I would like him back at a "decent" salary.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:11 PM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

He's a stud.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:12 PM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

I think MJ has been brilliant this year. I never thought of him as a really dominant pass rusher, but he's always been good against the run, and he's durable as well. He's been rushing the passer quite well, and he's great at sealing the edge. I'd have no problem signing him long term as I think he still has the potential to be even better. I think losing him would kill our defensive line; the guy plays more snaps than anyone else.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:15 PM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

I want the team to resign MJ.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:32 PM
Just win in 2010 Just win in 2010 is offline
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Would love to resign him, but I still want another pass rusher with the first three picks.
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:47 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Letting Michael Johnson get away would be insanity. And he is still growing into that tremendous body, and learning every game.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:31 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

MJ appears to be taking a leadership role on sideline lately.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:44 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawless_1 View Post
Some on here may have seen me say that MJ has been highly overrated on these boards and while I stand by that for the most part I am willing to say this.... Hie performance this year is his own doing... not Dunlap's.... no Geno's.... it is his doing.

There is no way a guy on one end that has 2 sacks on the year had anything to do with a guy on the other end having 8... shut up with that nonsense.

Now onto his contract.

If we can sign him or Andre before free agency great. We can use the franchise tag on the other guy and see what he does next year. If he gets to free agency forget him he is gone. Someone will give him a hefty contract in free agency that will be beyond what he is worth like Antwan Odom the year we signed him. I'm still not that sold on him but I would like him back at a "decent" salary.
Agree with everything but the franchise tag part. Those are expensive positions! Worst case scenario, we use our 1st on the one that leaves.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:57 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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Originally Posted by ThunderCloud View Post
Letting Michael Johnson get away would be insanity. And he is still growing into that tremendous body, and learning every game.
I agree. I hope we re-sign him, but still draft a DE high to keep the rotation strong. I would like to see Geathers gone unless he is willing to come back at a much cheaper price. Keeping our DL fresh has really helped us overall, and we would be wise to continue the same pattern to help keep that productivity.
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  #10  
Old 11-28-2012, 08:22 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

I want MJ back, but not if it requires us paying him premier pass rusher money.

2009: 16 games, 0 starts, 16 tackles, 3 sacks
2010: 16 games, 10 starts, 34 tackles, 2.5 sacks
2011: 16 games, 5 starts, 43 tackles, 6 sacks
2012: 16 games, 16 starts, 51 tackles, 11.5 sacks (at current pace)

I just don't see MJ as someone who will consistently post around 10 sacks.

Hopefully we can get him for around what the Jaguars gave Jeremy Mincey.

After posting 57 tackles, 8 sacks, 4 ff and an int, the Jags gave Mincey a 4 year deal worth 27.2 million. Something close to that would be fair.
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  #11  
Old 11-28-2012, 08:35 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

MJ is quickly becoming my favorite Bengal, he put in a ton of work in the off-season to improve his play and it has worked. He is becoming a leader on the field and is holding people accountable. I think he is a must have player on this defense and should be retained. I do not think it will take an outrageous amount of money to keep him either, he loves it here and is very close to the community (see front page article for proof). The Bengals took a chance on him coming out of College when other teams said he was lazy and would never amount to much at this level, he started out slow but is really catching fire now with no signs of slowing down. The man is an absolute freak of an athlete and his durability alone is worthy of a contract. If the Bengals must lose a DE I would rather see Dunlap go than Johnson. I know one poster mentioned that they didnt think MJ could put up 10 sacks seasons consistently, but I disagree. This is the first year of him playing at his current weight, so he will only get better as he adjust to the added pounds. He will continue to get stronger which will increase his push into the backfield. I for one think that MJ is an essential piece of the success of this defense.
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  #12  
Old 11-28-2012, 09:13 AM
Mike M (the other one) Mike M (the other one) is offline
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shake n Blake View Post
I want MJ back, but not if it requires us paying him premier pass rusher money.

2009: 16 games, 0 starts, 16 tackles, 3 sacks
2010: 16 games, 10 starts, 34 tackles, 2.5 sacks
2011: 16 games, 5 starts, 43 tackles, 6 sacks
2012: 16 games, 16 starts, 51 tackles, 11.5 sacks (at current pace)

I just don't see MJ as someone who will consistently post around 10 sacks.

Hopefully we can get him for around what the Jaguars gave Jeremy Mincey.

After posting 57 tackles, 8 sacks, 4 ff and an int, the Jags gave Mincey a 4 year deal worth 27.2 million. Something close to that would be fair.
Not really fair to base anything off of his first couple of years, since he wasn't strictly a DE like he has been the last 2 (and not to mention that last year there wasn't any time in training camp to teach and develop him). I think he will be an 8+ sack/year type of guy and I see no problem with giving him a good contract for another 3-4 years. We need to grow/develop our own and do our best to keep them.
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  #13  
Old 11-28-2012, 09:24 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

My god, how many D-Linemen are we gonna' have? We have, what 5 DT's? Peko, Geno, Sims, Still, Thompson.

And then Johnson, Geathers, Dunlap, and Gilberry (? end or DT ?) And who am I forgetting?

Is this normal? I like the young guys, agree with whoever said to see Geathers go, and then get an end. But some of these DT's aren't getting much playing time.
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  #14  
Old 11-28-2012, 09:32 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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Originally Posted by RumbleCat View Post
My god, how many D-Linemen are we gonna' have? We have, what 5 DT's? Peko, Geno, Sims, Still, Thompson.

And then Johnson, Geathers, Dunlap, and Gilberry (? end or DT ?) And who am I forgetting?

Is this normal? I like the young guys, agree with whoever said to see Geathers go, and then get an end. But some of these DT's aren't getting much playing time.
I'm down for it, dude.

it's about time we started cultivating some depth and planned ahead

that's what consistent winners do
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:35 AM
Mike M (the other one) Mike M (the other one) is offline
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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I'm down for it, dude.

it's about time we started cultivating some depth and planned ahead

that's what consistent winners do
I'm all for having quality depth, but I don't think it's necessary to keep drafting 1st round DE's as was suggested in here unless we have zero positions of need, and unfortunately we have some other needs that need to be addressed first before spending picks on luxuries.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:37 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

If our Dline is truly the heart and soul of the team we need to re-sign MJ. We won't be able to find his replacement in FA and why make the same mistake we made in the past blowing money trying to replace TJ and JJ instead of just re-signing them. I don't want to go into the draft desperate for a DE and RT so I hope we take care of those two this offseason.

Last edited by jj22; 11-28-2012 at 09:51 AM.
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  #17  
Old 11-28-2012, 09:38 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

I don't get the people that want to just let him walk. I see comments about how he has underachieved. So many idiot fans have no concept of player development. They expect a player to be a finished product right away and if he isn't a pro bowler as a rookie he is a bust.

MJ is just coming into his prime as a player. It would be foolish to take the time to develop a guy and then just let him go once be becomes a very good player.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:39 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Other than Pacman, no one plays with more heart and intensity than MJ.
Not that I think he's a must sign, but he has played better.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:41 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shake n Blake View Post
I want MJ back, but not if it requires us paying him premier pass rusher money.

2009: 16 games, 0 starts, 16 tackles, 3 sacks
2010: 16 games, 10 starts, 34 tackles, 2.5 sacks
2011: 16 games, 5 starts, 43 tackles, 6 sacks
2012: 16 games, 16 starts, 51 tackles, 11.5 sacks (at current pace)

I just don't see MJ as someone who will consistently post around 10 sacks.

Hopefully we can get him for around what the Jaguars gave Jeremy Mincey.

After posting 57 tackles, 8 sacks, 4 ff and an int, the Jags gave Mincey a 4 year deal worth 27.2 million. Something close to that would be fair.
So, let me get this straight,

You are using his rookie year and then the following 2 years where he was moved around as a SAM and told to gain weight, lose weight, play standing up, play with his hand on the ground as a basis for saying he won't consistently post 10 sacks?

I don't see how you wouldn't extend this guy. He's reliable and has started to show that he can handle a full season of starting work and is starting to show promise as a pass rusher,

AND HE'S 25. These are the types of guys you sign and keep when you build a team.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:47 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

What is Johnson's value?

A guy like Kendall Langford signed a 4 year $24 million contract. Johnson has more productivity than him.

It may very well come down to a numbers game with Johnson, Atkins, and Dunlap. Can we afford to pay all 3 highly?

Geathers contract coming off the books helps a lot to retain one of the ends. I feel that Atkins is a must re-sign.

It might come down to choosing between Johnson or Dunlap and then drafting a replacement.
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  #21  
Old 11-28-2012, 09:50 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

Michael Johnson is playing very well currently, but to claim it is all him is a red herring. MJ was playing only so-so football previous to Dunlap getting healthy and back in the lineup. Additionally, to ignore the benefit of playing next to possibly the most disruptive DT in the NFL is incorrect logic as well.


As I mentioned in another thread, this season by MJ is reminiscent of that of another DE in a contract year with the Titams a few years back. I am wary of the Bengals giving MJ a big payday when this is basically a one year wonder performance.


Hopefully MJ continues to shine and play well, but looking at his track record, one has to be leery of whether this is the new MJ, or a guy playing for a big contract. I would re-sign him to a reasonable contract, as he may be the real deal, but wouldn't throw the checkbook at him, as this may also be fool's gold.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:52 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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Originally Posted by TGISunday View Post
Agree with everything but the franchise tag part. Those are expensive positions! Worst case scenario, we use our 1st on the one that leaves.
While your statement is reasonable, it would be very irresponsible on the part of the front office.

What would the point be of saving salary cap money for extending your own players, and then not extending your own players? We need to get stronger, not break even.
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:10 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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While your statement is reasonable, it would be very irresponsible on the part of the front office.

What would the point be of saving salary cap money for extending your own players, and then not extending your own players? We need to get stronger, not break even.
That should be the plan. Especially if we are going to end up spending more to try to find their replacements.
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  #24  
Old 11-28-2012, 10:12 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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Originally Posted by Just win in 2010 View Post
Would love to resign him, but I still want another pass rusher with the first three picks.
we are replacing Geathers next year... And wouldnt need another pass rusher if dunlap will step up..

But we need to resign MJ so far his Career >>> than dunlaps.

And production is what matters.
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:13 AM
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Default Re: Micheal Johnson: My View

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Originally Posted by Hammerstripes View Post
So, let me get this straight,

You are using his rookie year and then the following 2 years where he was moved around as a SAM and told to gain weight, lose weight, play standing up, play with his hand on the ground as a basis for saying he won't consistently post 10 sacks?

I don't see how you wouldn't extend this guy. He's reliable and has started to show that he can handle a full season of starting work and is starting to show promise as a pass rusher,

AND HE'S 25. These are the types of guys you sign and keep when you build a team.
I said I would extend the guy, but do you think he's worth 80 million?

MJ just doesn't seem to always be around the QB with constant pressure. He might pick up a sack sometimes, but I don't look at MJ as a pass rushing force. How many pressures does he have this year?

Again, at 4 years/30 million or maybe even 5 years/40 million, I would sign him in a heartbeat. 5 years/70 million (or something similar)? PASS.

Things change with a quickness. Before this season, everyone and their mom was saying Dunlap was the man and we needed to sign him ASAP to a huge contract. Now look.
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If you think Dalton will average 25 passes per game, put your money where your mouth is. I'll even make it easy on you.

If Dalton averages over 30 passes per game in 2014, I win. If he averages less than 30, you win. Loser can't post in any Dalton threads for 1 year. You game?
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Yes, log it.

Last edited by Shake n Blake; 11-28-2012 at 10:15 AM.
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