Cincinnati Bengals

Go Back   Cincinnati Bengals Message Boards - Forums > Cincinnati Bengals Football Discussion > The NFL Draft

The NFL Draft Year-round discussion of all aspects of the NFL Draft, including a subforum specifically dedicated to mock drafts.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #26  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:24 PM
eliminate08's Avatar
eliminate08 eliminate08 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Star Valley, Wyoming
Posts: 18,752
Rep Points: 24693
bengals Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Well Austin isn't what we would need at WR anyways IF WR is a need by then.
We have an Austin-type in Hawkins. Same skill set. Would need to be used the same way.

Franklin is good. Had fumbling issues in his career.
He is definitely on my list. Lot's of good mid-round RBs. No real front runners.


Austin has played RB though unlike Hawk.

Yeah, i like Franklin, reminds me of Ray Rice.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:28 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by eliminate08 View Post


Austin has played RB though unlike Hawk.

Yeah, i like Franklin, reminds me of Ray Rice.
So? Doesn't make him a RB.

Franklin reminds me nothing of Ray Rice.
completely different builds and running styles.
If I compared anyone in this draft to Ray Rice, it would probably be Dennis Johnson from Arkansas.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:30 PM
BengalHawk62's Avatar
BengalHawk62 BengalHawk62 is offline
VIP Silver Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: East of Omaha
Posts: 2,147
Rep Points: 3501
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Tyler Wilson.
Matt Barkley.
Geno Smith.

One of them. They aren't RG3 and Luck, but they are still good NFL prospects in their own right.
If I were the Chiefs GM, I'd throw everything I could to get Alex Smith from the 49ers. I think he's in a contract year now anyways. And then work the other positions of need in the draft. OL, DL, LB, CB, etc. I'd do whatever it took to stay away from those QBs. This has got to be one of the weakest drafts for QBs in recent memory. Maybe draft one of them in the later rounds if one falls.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:34 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalHawk62 View Post
If I were the Chiefs GM, I'd throw everything I could to get Alex Smith from the 49ers. I think he's in a contract year now anyways. And then work the other positions of need in the draft. OL, DL, LB, CB, etc. I'd do whatever it took to stay away from those QBs. This has got to be one of the weakest drafts for QBs in recent memory. Maybe draft one of them in the later rounds if one falls.
Bwahahahahahahahaha
Seriously? Why not just take a guy who at least has potential in them like Wilson or Barkley over spending picks on Trent Dilfer 2.0 anyways?

All Alex Smith does in SF is not lose games. He let's Gore/Hunter and the D win games. He just has to not lose them.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:35 PM
stknux stknux is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 62
Rep Points: 61
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

I like Johnathan Franklin and Dennis Johnson.
Also, Christine Michael just leapfrogged Franklin in the newest cbssports.com rankings to #8 overall: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/p...nkings/2013/RB
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:45 PM
BengalHawk62's Avatar
BengalHawk62 BengalHawk62 is offline
VIP Silver Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: East of Omaha
Posts: 2,147
Rep Points: 3501
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Bwahahahahahahahaha
Seriously? Why not just take a guy who at least has potential in them like Wilson or Barkley over spending picks on Trent Dilfer 2.0 anyways?

All Alex Smith does in SF is not lose games. He let's Gore/Hunter and the D win games. He just has to not lose them.
Potential is in the eye of the beholder. Ask any Chief fan out there if they would take Alex Smith over any QB on their roster now? I never said A. Smith was good, I just said I'd try to get him away from the 49ers. Keep building a strong Defense and get a god-d***ed offensive line to protect the QB.
__________________

Last edited by BengalHawk62; 11-29-2012 at 04:14 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:47 PM
bfine32's Avatar
bfine32 bfine32 is offline
MB HOF Inductee
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Radcliff, KY
Posts: 19,441
Rep Points: 34445
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Bwahahahahahahahaha
Seriously? Why not just take a guy who at least has potential in them like Wilson or Barkley over spending picks on Trent Dilfer 2.0 anyways?

All Alex Smith does in SF is not lose games. He let's Gore/Hunter and the D win games. He just has to not lose them.
Smith woulda taken San Fran to the Super Bowl last year if Goldston could hold on to the ball. He would be a perfect fit in KC, they have Charles/Hillis and a talented young D. I wouldn't "throw everything at them" but I'd definately see if they wanted an extra 3rd.

No QB in this draft is worth the overall #1 and I have a feeling on draft day we will see that as well. Their best case is to find somebody who wants to trade up for Jones, move back in the 1st and pick up some extra picks.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:48 PM
eliminate08's Avatar
eliminate08 eliminate08 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Star Valley, Wyoming
Posts: 18,752
Rep Points: 24693
bengals Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
So? Doesn't make him a RB.

Franklin reminds me nothing of Ray Rice.
completely different builds and running styles.
If I compared anyone in this draft to Ray Rice, it would probably be Dennis Johnson from Arkansas.


Austin is a playmaker plain and simple. I think he will be a stud at the next level and you
can use him in multiple ways not just receiver. I just think he would bring some much
needed speed to the backfield. Hawk is not a RB in any way.

What i saw from Franklin is he is very hard to tackle, has great hands out of the backfield
and can make something out of nothing. I guess that is where he reminds me of Rice.

I like Dennis Johnson too though, no doubt. Imagine if we had a Ray Rice type player on
our Offense. Just try to stop us. The Raven's whole Offense has been Rice.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 11-29-2012, 02:52 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalHawk62 View Post
Potential is in the eye of the beholder. Ask any Chief fan out there if they would take Alex Smith over any QB on their roster now? I never said A. Smith was good, I just said I'd try to get him away from the 49ers. Keep building a strong Defense and get a god-damned offensive line to protect the QB.
Is he better than Cassel? Maybe. He certainly was on Cassel's level of ineptitude before Harbaugh.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 11-29-2012, 03:04 PM
Lolli's Avatar
Lolli Lolli is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CTC
Posts: 9,320
Rep Points: 12569
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBlesmiley View Post
They had absolutely no offensive line and an offense that resembled nothing short of a Bear Bryant 3 yards and a cloud of dust offense.lol. His blocking is devastating, receiving skills are at a pro level and this team has an offensive line that can get him 2nd level quickly right now without a center. I think he's just as good as Trent Richardson coming out considering his line had pro prospects all over it. Thats why I'm not so high on Eddie Lacy as most. Le'Veon really reminds me of Hershel Walker just a tad slower. He faces 8 men in the box every Saturday and if you do that against our current roster our recieving core will kill you.
I think he will put up a 4.62 in the 40.

If he runs less than a 4.55 or less, I am interested.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 11-29-2012, 03:06 PM
Lolli's Avatar
Lolli Lolli is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CTC
Posts: 9,320
Rep Points: 12569
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcholas View Post
I want
Manti Te'o
Unless we start losing, we will not see him.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 11-29-2012, 03:08 PM
Lolli's Avatar
Lolli Lolli is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CTC
Posts: 9,320
Rep Points: 12569
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Tyler Wilson.
Matt Barkley.
Geno Smith.

One of them. They aren't RG3 and Luck, but they are still good NFL prospects in their own right.
I agree. The rules are different for QBs. If you do not have one, you cannot win. If you are desperate for a QB, you have to take one.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 11-29-2012, 04:13 PM
BengalHawk62's Avatar
BengalHawk62 BengalHawk62 is offline
VIP Silver Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: East of Omaha
Posts: 2,147
Rep Points: 3501
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Is he better than Cassel? Maybe. He certainly was on Cassel's level of ineptitude before Harbaugh.
Isn't Smith 'lighter on the feet' than Cassell? Smith can extend plays with his feet better than Cassell ever could. Before Harbaugh, he had Mike Singletary as his HC. How much ineptitude should be blamed on him?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 11-29-2012, 04:17 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalHawk62 View Post
Isn't Smith 'lighter on the feet' than Cassell? Smith can extend plays with his feet better than Cassell ever could. Before Harbaugh, he had Mike Singletary as his HC. How much ineptitude should be blamed on him?
With Harbaugh he is nothing more than a game manager.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 11-29-2012, 04:31 PM
Jasonew6's Avatar
Jasonew6 Jasonew6 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,344
Rep Points: 28126
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalHawk62 View Post
Why not? Pioli is going to be a goner anyways.
MLB just doesn't carry that much value. I agree there isn't a true #1 QB this year, but I think it is still likely a QB goes #1. Or possibly a LT or DT.
__________________

Just because science can explain it doesn't mean God didn't do it.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 11-30-2012, 08:04 AM
BengalHawk62's Avatar
BengalHawk62 BengalHawk62 is offline
VIP Silver Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: East of Omaha
Posts: 2,147
Rep Points: 3501
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
With Harbaugh he is nothing more than a game manager.
Which is exactly what the Chiefs need. Somebody to not lose the game for them. Alex Smith would be perfect for the Chiefs. Like somebody earlier here said, get Smith and then hope that somebody is willing to trade up so they can accumulate extra picks.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 11-30-2012, 09:17 AM
Au165 Au165 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,130
Rep Points: 3984
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lolli View Post
I think he will put up a 4.62 in the 40.

If he runs less than a 4.55 or less, I am interested.
I think Bell is the Doug Martin of this draft. Not that he necessarily will be as good as a rookie( I think he could be), but rather he will be a guy not many had heard of that will shoot up draft boards. I called Martin very early in the process last year and I think Bell could see immediate success as a rookie. His speed does not scare me as Emmit Smith ran a 4.55.

A 40 means little to a RB because how often do they go through a line completely untouched? I am more interested in what his first 10 yards look like and what his lateral movement looks like. Can he make guys miss in the hole? Can he catch and pass protect, so that he can stay on the field for all three downs? Can he take a hit and keep going? I think Bell can do all of these things and I want this kid with one of our seconds.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 11-30-2012, 09:27 AM
shaolinghost shaolinghost is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 3,572
Rep Points: 4645
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by BengalHawk62 View Post
Which is exactly what the Chiefs need. Somebody to not lose the game for them. Alex Smith would be perfect for the Chiefs. Like somebody earlier here said, get Smith and then hope that somebody is willing to trade up so they can accumulate extra picks.
I think Harbaugh did much more to make the 49ers great than most people realize. That team was a perfect example of talent without direction before he got there.

Now I know Smith had a bunch of different OCs since being in the NFL, but what does it say about him if Harbaugh benches him at the first opportunity? Smith would be a good stop-gap QB so a team didn't sink into the abyss, but he can't carry a team.

Pre Harbaugh:
2005-2010
19-33(.365) as a starter
56.0%
6.0ypa
9392yards
51tds(16tds/season)
53ints(16ints/season)
69.2rating

During Harbaugh:
19-5(.792)(+.427)
65.7%(+9.7%)
7.7ypa(+1.7ypa)
4803yards(+312yards/season)
29tds(+3tds/season)
10ints(-6ints/season)
96.8rating(+27.6 rating)

In summation: Harbaugh took a below average QB and turned him into an efficient QB with a winning record. Alex Smith will be the next Matt Cassel; a product of a great team and coach.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 11-30-2012, 09:40 AM
Lolli's Avatar
Lolli Lolli is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CTC
Posts: 9,320
Rep Points: 12569
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Au165 View Post
I think Bell is the Doug Martin of this draft. Not that he necessarily will be as good as a rookie( I think he could be), but rather he will be a guy not many had heard of that will shoot up draft boards. I called Martin very early in the process last year and I think Bell could see immediate success as a rookie. His speed does not scare me as Emmit Smith ran a 4.55.

A 40 means little to a RB because how often do they go through a line completely untouched? I am more interested in what his first 10 yards look like and what his lateral movement looks like. Can he make guys miss in the hole? Can he catch and pass protect, so that he can stay on the field for all three downs? Can he take a hit and keep going? I think Bell can do all of these things and I want this kid with one of our seconds.
Emmit Smith was not very good (but he did not stink either). He played on a team that had one of the most dominant OLs ever. Think of what Barry Sanders could have done behind that line.

If Bell puts up a 4.6+, he is a mroe athletic BJGE. For a feature back, that is too slow.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 11-30-2012, 09:49 AM
Au165 Au165 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,130
Rep Points: 3984
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lolli View Post
Emmit Smith was not very good (but he did not stink either). He played on a team that had one of the most dominant OLs ever. Think of what Barry Sanders could have done behind that line.

If Bell puts up a 4.6+, he is a mroe athletic BJGE. For a feature back, that is too slow.
That's a cop out. Barry Sanders was on another level, but to say Smith wasn't a very good back just because of his line is laughable. By the way Doug Martin ran a 4.55 and Alfred Morris ran a 4.67. Daniel Thomas, Mark Ingraham, Mickel Leshore, Jacquizz Rodgers, Ryan Williams, Shonn Green All ran 4.55+ 40's and are starting or are the backs of the future for their teams.

Last edited by Au165; 11-30-2012 at 09:57 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 11-30-2012, 12:15 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

It isn't about speed with Bell. It is about explosion and burst. There is none. It seems like it takes 2 days to get to full speed.
Emmit had incredible balance and was extremely shifty.
Bell is neither of those things.
Emmit may not have been fast, but he got to his top speed quickly.
Bell doesn't do that.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 11-30-2012, 12:16 PM
eliminate08's Avatar
eliminate08 eliminate08 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Star Valley, Wyoming
Posts: 18,752
Rep Points: 24693
bengals Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
It isn't about speed with Bell. It is about explosion and burst. There is none. It seems like it takes 2 days to get to full speed.
Emmit had incredible balance and was extremely shifty.
Bell is neither of those things.
Emmit may not have been fast, but he got to his top speed quickly.
Bell doesn't do that.


Bell reminds me of a more athletic Brandon Jacobs.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 11-30-2012, 12:23 PM
Lolli's Avatar
Lolli Lolli is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CTC
Posts: 9,320
Rep Points: 12569
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Au165 View Post
That's a cop out. Barry Sanders was on another level, but to say Smith wasn't a very good back just because of his line is laughable. By the way Doug Martin ran a 4.55 and Alfred Morris ran a 4.67. Daniel Thomas, Mark Ingraham, Mickel Leshore, Jacquizz Rodgers, Ryan Williams, Shonn Green All ran 4.55+ 40's and are starting or are the backs of the future for their teams.
If you look back at my earlier post, I did use 4.55 as my line of delineation. Through observation, it looks like that speed or faster is one of the factors that play into a successful RB. Obviously there are more. You brought up one example of a decent back that is slower than that, and I am sure there are others. With BJGE already on the team, I do not see a lot of value in a player who is not significantly faster with better lateral agility and vision.

I do not think Smith was bad. I think he is as overhyped having come from that team with that OL as Ken Anderson is underhyped from having played on a Bengal's team. There is a certain BS factor.
__________________

Last edited by Lolli; 11-30-2012 at 12:26 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 11-30-2012, 12:40 PM
berserkerone88's Avatar
berserkerone88 berserkerone88 is offline
VIP Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Glenfiddich....I moved on to scotch
Posts: 18,827
Rep Points: 20702
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lolli View Post
If you look back at my earlier post, I did use 4.55 as my line of delineation. Through observation, it looks like that speed or faster is one of the factors that play into a successful RB. Obviously there are more. You brought up one example of a decent back that is slower than that, and I am sure there are others. With BJGE already on the team, I do not see a lot of value in a player who is not significantly faster with better lateral agility and vision.
The key to a successful RB isn't necessarily speed. It is that suddenness or burst. It is why slower RB's can work at times and look better than they might sound. It is what made Barry Sanders so great. When he went, the dude shot out like a cannon.

Take Trent Richardson for example. Not overwhelming speed at all. But seems to consistently rip off chunks of yards. He explodes through the hole and hits his top speed quickly. That is more important than straight line speed.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 12-02-2012, 10:27 AM
djam's Avatar
djam djam is offline
VIP Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Morgantown
Posts: 7,843
Rep Points: 17063
Default Re: Top Prospects at positions of need

Quote:
Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
So? Doesn't make him a RB.

Franklin reminds me nothing of Ray Rice.
completely different builds and running styles.
If I compared anyone in this draft to Ray Rice, it would probably be Dennis Johnson from Arkansas.
Funny you say that, he actually is more of a RB than a WR. He played RB his entire life until WVU put him in the slot so he could get it in open space more. Besides they had Noel Devine in front of him for a while. A lot of his 'receiving' yards came on little flip passes that most ppl thought were running plays anyway. Believe it or not he is very good between the tackles. Just ask Oklahoma lol.

I'd love to have Austin. Hes not a full time RB or WR as I see him in the NFL. He's just a weapon who can equally be used as both, and on ST. He would make Hawkins looks slow as a slot and would outrun Pacman on returns. There is no more dynamic player with moves like that in college right now. I normally stay away from WVU players in my 'early' draft wishes but not this dude. I'd love to have him because his weaponry for us could be huge. With an extra 2nr round pick, I'd love to have him if he drops that far.

Last edited by djam; 12-02-2012 at 10:30 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2012 Cincinnati Bengals. All rights reserved. Do not duplicate in any form without permission of the Cincinnati Bengals.