Take drugs like you're supposed to!

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by RumbleCat

And I brought about 5 extra and they were in my cigarette pack.

Don't do this.

Keep your xanax in its prescription bottle. If a police officer stopped you for whatever reason and found the xanax in your cigarette pack you could be arrested for possession of a controlled substance.

[Who2Dey]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

Low dose to whom?

0.25mg is a starting dose. If you haven't developed tolerance 1mg can be a high dose.

Plus there are immediate release tablets and extended release tablets so someone is much more likely to "get high" from a 1mg immediate release tablet vs. a 1mg extended release tablet. 0.25mg three times/day is a starting dose of immediate release xanax vs. 3mg once a day of extended release for panic attacks. Immediate release comes in strengths of 0.25, 0.5, 1, and 2mg. 3mg is the max single dose in people who have developed tolerance. So 1mg is not a very low dose.

How much cash can a physician pull in from pharmaceutical companies by pushing their drugs? Is the whooping cough vaccine a crock o **** as I suspect? I get suspicious when I see companies buying ad space for us to get whooping cough vaccine all of a sudden.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by jmccracky

I keep getting prescribed everything BUT Xanax.

I hate xanax. It is one of the most popularly abused and highly addictive medications used for recreational abuse.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Who2Dey

How much cash can a physician pull in from pharmaceutical companies by pushing their drugs? Is the whooping cough vaccine a crock o **** as I suspect? I get suspicious when I see companies buying ad space for us to get whooping cough vaccine all of a sudden.

I don't know. I don't get any cash from pharmaceutical companies. I don't personally know any doctors who get cash from pharmaceutical companies. When I was in the military we didn't even get visits from sales reps because we had no control of which medicines were carried on the formulary.

I have called a sales rep at home and they drove over an hour to bring me samples of an expensive antibiotic for a patient without insurance who needed it, but couldn't afford it.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Who2Dey

Yall need to get off the pain killers. Pain should be taken out of the title...they are flat out killers. You will build a tolerance and will need stronger pills. Your life will revolve around your pill schedule.

They are highly addictive and kill more americans than heroin and cocaine combined. It's a deadly racket and should have been one of the top issues discussed during the presidential race but wasn't because of the cash it brings in.

Those in serious pain should buy a bag of good weed and research baking it in brownies. Since it is consumed through your digestive track it effects the body differently than simply smoking it. 10000000 times safer than the pills the doc is giving you.

It is disgusting the amount of people I know personally that have died from prescription drugs. It's amazing that the pharmaceutical companies just float along unscathed as they are killing citizens and turning the rest into zombies.

Good luck and be careful.

I'm not an expert, but I think 20 states have legalized medical marijuana. What's your recommendation for people that have real chronic pain, but don't have access to medical marijuana and don't want to break the law?

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

Low dose to whom?

0.25mg is a starting dose. If you haven't developed tolerance 1mg can be a high dose.
.

Yes, I was wrong. I was confusing .5 mg dosage with 5 mg dose.

[Who2Dey]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

I'm not an expert, but I think 20 states have legalized medical marijuana. What's your recommendation for people that have real chronic pain, but don't have access to medical marijuana and don't want to break the law?

I'd bet those 20 states also aren't at the top of the list for oxcy abuse. Maybe the reason we see so much prescription abuse in this part of the country is related?

I'd recommend they break the law. It's their body, not the laws. Id take my chances on the $100 weed ticket than a dangerous/legal drug addiction. But that's me, I realize there are people that believe weed is a dangerous evil drug because it is illegal and will never choose this option. Simply saying it's safer, and is out there.

First off if one of these patients were to give any other treatment a fair shot they would need the 'scrips out of their system. Not sure how long it would take? Couple days? They would need to know going in that they will be uncomfortable for a couple days and ready to deal with it. During that period I would suggest medical massage and maybe something like L-arginine to get the blood flowing without straining other parts of your body by over compensating.

I'd suggest stretching, hot cold treatments, acupuncture, goat semen, anything before prescription pain medication. I'm not saying it will definitely work, I'm asking why not try the safer options if you havent? It's the patients choice though and they will have to make the sacrifice. Unfortunately im just a guy on the internet and not a trusted dr.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Morning Star

I am really leary of drugs..I just hear all those side effects and it scares me..last spring I had allergies and took Benadryl around the clock..I would not even try Claratin..just leary of all those side effects.

Here's an excerpt from the benadryl package insert...

http://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed...fo.cfm?id=1029

CONTRAINDICATIONS



Use in Neonates or Premature Infants

This drug should not be used in neonates or premature infants.

Use in Nursing Mothers

Because of the higher risk of antihistamines for infants generally, and for neonates and prematures in particular, antihistamine therapy is contraindicated in nursing mothers.

Use as a Local Anesthetic

Because of the risk of local necrosis, this drug should not be used as a local anesthetic.
Antihistamines are also contraindicated in the following conditions: Hypersensitivity to diphenhydramine hydrochloride and other antihistamines of similar chemical structure.

WARNINGS

Antihistamines should be used with considerable caution in patients with narrow-angle glaucoma, stenosing peptic ulcer, pyloroduodenal obstruction, symptomatic prostatic hypertrophy, or bladder-neck obstruction.
Local necrosis has been associated with the use of subcutaneous or intradermal use of intravenous Benadryl.

Use in Pediatric Patients

In pediatric patients, especially, antihistamines in overdosage may cause hallucinations, convulsions, or death.
As in adults, antihistamines may diminish mental alertness in pediatric patients. In the young pediatric patient, particularly, they may produce excitation.

Use in the Elderly (approximately 60 years or older)

Antihistamines are more likely to cause dizziness, sedation, and hypotension in elderly patients.

PRECAUTIONS



General

Diphenhydramine hydrochloride has an atropine-like action and, therefore, should be used with caution in patients with a history of bronchial asthma, increased intraocular pressure, hyperthyroidism, cardiovascular disease or hypertension. Use with caution in patients with lower respiratory disease including asthma.

Information for Patients

Patients taking diphenhydramine hydrochloride should be advised that this drug may cause drowsiness and has an additive effect with alcohol.
Patients should be warned about engaging in activities requiring mental alertness such as driving a car or operating appliances, machinery, etc.

Drug Interactions

Diphenhydramine hydrochloride has additive effects with alcohol and other CNS depressants (hypnotics, sedatives, tranquilizers, etc).
MAO inhibitors prolong and intensify the anticholinergic (drying) effects of antihistamines.

Carcinogenesis, Mutagenesis, Impairment of Fertility

Long-term studies in animals to determine mutagenic and carcinogenic potential have not been performed.

Pregnancy



Pregnancy Category B

Reproduction studies have been performed in rats and rabbits at doses up to 5 times the human dose and have revealed no evidence of impaired fertility or harm to the fetus due to diphenhydramine hydrochloride. There are, however, no adequate and well-controlled studies in pregnant women. Because animal reproduction studies are not always predictive of human response, this drug should be used during pregnancy only if clearly needed.

Pediatric Use

Benadryl should not be used in neonates and premature infants (see CONTRAINDICATIONS).
Benadryl may diminish mental alertness, or, in the young pediatric patient, cause excitation. Overdosage may cause hallucinations, convulsions, or death (see WARNINGS and OVERDOSAGE).
See also DOSAGE AND ADMINISTRATION section.

ADVERSE REACTIONS



The most frequent adverse reactions are underscored.

1. General: Urticaria, drug rash, anaphylactic shock, photosensitivity, excessive perspiration, chills, dryness of mouth, nose, and throat
2. Cardiovascular System: Hypotension, headache, palpitations, tachycardia, extrasystoles
3. Hematologic System: Hemolytic anemia, thrombocytopenia, agranulocytosis
4. Nervous System: Sedation, sleepiness, dizziness, disturbed coordination, fatigue, confusion, restlessness, excitation, nervousness, tremor, irritability, insomnia, euphoria, paresthesia, blurred vision, diplopia, vertigo, tinnitus, acute labyrinthitis, neuritis, convulsions
5. Gl System: Epigastric distress, anorexia, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, constipation
6. GU System: Urinary frequency, difficult urination, urinary retention, early menses
7. Respiratory System: Thickening of bronchial secretions, tightness of chest or throat and wheezing, nasal stuffiness

OVERDOSAGE

Antihistamine overdosage reactions may vary from central nervous system depression to stimulation. Stimulation is particularly likely in pediatric patients. Atropine-like signs and symptoms; dry mouth; fixed, dilated pupils; flushing; and gastrointestinal symptoms may also occur.
Stimulants should not be used.
Vasopressors may be used to treat hypotension.

Be afraid. Be very, very afraid.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by fredtoast

Yes, I was wrong. I was confusing .5 mg dosage with 5 mg dose.

Pfft. 0.5mg vs 5mg.

Hey, what's a missplaced decimal point with a lawyer? No biggie. Right?

[jmccracky]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

I hate xanax. It is one of the most popularly abused and highly addictive medications used for recreational abuse.

That is one of the reasons why I stopped taking them. Fear of getting them without an Rx and getting caught, and I've seen what they can do to people. Highly addictive. It works for panic and anxiety though. I've just said screw it and deal with my anxiety/panic attack issues. I've done the following-

1. I quit smoking cigs.

2. Cut way down on alcohol. I used to drink every day. Now, more like twice a month. Gradually been cutting back and plan to cut it out entirely.

3. Get more rest taking melatonin and Valerian root.

Not sure if it is all in my head, but before the melatonin, I was an insomniac and it seems to be working. Same with the Valerian. I would get 2 hours of sleep on a good night. Now, I can get anywhere from 4 to 9 hours. I hadn't slept for more than 6 hours in YEARS. Most of it was probably sleep apnea, but that seems to have disappeared since I quit smoking cigs and don't drink like Lindsay Lohan anymore. My fiance said I will snore at a low level now, instead of sawing logs. She said I also don't stop breathing in my sleep anymore. I can tell the difference, big time.

Committing to all three of these things has helped immensely. So, I won't even ask for any meds or Xanax at my next doctor appointment. I'll just let him know that what I've been doing has helped and maybe we can go from there.

[silenetwolf]

Originally Posted by Nebuchadnezzar

Went to the doctor today and Vicodin 10/660 is being discontinued because people are over dosing on Tylenol. Now I am taking Vicodin 10/500 and will most likely have to pop Ibuprohin to get rid of the headache the will cause.

Freaking people wanting to get high and causing long term damage to their liver or death ruin it for those who actually need the stuff to function. Or it's people who are just downright stupid and popping a 10/660 then dropping Tylenol PM's to help them sleep. "I didn't know Tylenol was bad for you", did you listen to you doctor? It's not bad for you, TOO MUCH IS BAD FOR YOU YOU RICHARD CRANEUM!!!

On a serious note, it's all good. The 10/500 has the same amount of the Opiate just less Tylenol.

I can relate to what you are saying. I am currently taking eight different meds. The doc can call in seven of them, but I have to go to his office and get a written prescription for Klonopin. He will only give enough to last 30 days, then I have to go back in to get it refilled. All because idiots get it and then sell it on the streets. He can't even fax it in.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Who2Dey

I'd bet those 20 states also aren't at the top of the list for oxcy abuse. Maybe the reason we see so much prescription abuse in this part of the country is related?

Again, I don't know. Why don't you do a little research to prove or disprove your speculation.

I'd recommend they break the law. It's their body, not the laws. Id take my chances on the $100 weed ticket than a dangerous/legal drug addiction. But that's me, I realize there are people that believe weed is a dangerous evil drug because it is illegal and will never choose this option. Simply saying it's safer, and is out there.

http://norml.org/pdf_files/state_pen..._Penalties.pdf

According to NORML, in Ohio marijuana possession is a $150 fine if the amount is less than 100g.

So if a person has chronic back pain and they need one Vicodin 10/660 every 6 hours to control their pain, how much medical marijuana do they need to smoke or injest each day to control their pain? If a patient had a month's supply of medical marijuana would that amount be more than 100g and thus they would face increased penalties for medical marijuana possession?

And what would you suggest to the people who have jobs that require them to take a urinalysis for their continued employment?

First off if one of these patients were to give any other treatment a fair shot they would need the 'scrips out of their system. Not sure how long it would take? Couple days?

It would take 2-3 days for the opiates to no longer be detectable with a urinalysis. But that is when the physical withdrawal is just starting to peak and 5-10 days for the physical withdrawal to end. The psychological withdrawal will last weeks to months.

They would need to know going in that they will be uncomfortable for a couple days and ready to deal with it. During that period I would suggest medical massage and maybe something like L-arginine

So narcotic withdrawal is "uncomfortable"? I don't think people who have experienced narcotic withdrawal would actual describe it as "uncomfortable".

And you would suggest massage an an amino acid? That must be why narcotic dependence and addiction is so easy to treat! Damn, I wish you taught me this little nugget of wisdom back when I was quitting Copenhagen. It would have made it soooo much easier.

to get the blood flowing without straining other parts of your body by over compensating.

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean. I'm fairly certain you don't know either.

I'd suggest stretching, hot cold treatments, acupuncture, goat semen, anything before prescription pain medication. I'm not saying it will definitely work, I'm asking why not try the safer options if you havent? It's the patients choice though and they will have to make the sacrifice. Unfortunately im just a guy on the internet and not a trusted dr.

Oh, you've been very helpful. I asked what you would recommend for the majority of pain sufferers who don't have access to legal medical marijuana and you offered goat semen. Thanks. From now on, I'm going to print your response and give it to every suspected addict and chronic pain sufferer I see just so they are fully informed of their alternatives.

[Lawless_1]

This is why I only take the not so legal kinda pain medicine.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by silenetwolf

I can relate to what you are saying. I am currently taking eight different meds. The doc can call in seven of them, but I have to go to his office and get a written prescription for Klonopin. He will only give enough to last 30 days, then I have to go back in to get it refilled. All because idiots get it and then sell it on the streets. He can't even fax it in.

That doesn't make any sense. Klonopin is a schedule IV benzodiazepine and according to the DEA your doc can call it in or fax it. What you are describing sounds like schedule II restrictions

http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/pu...t/section2.htm

Schedule IV Substances

Substances in this schedule havea lower potential for abuse relative to substances in Schedule III.
Examples of a Schedule IV narcotics include propoxyphene (Darvon® and Darvocet-N 100®).
Other Schedule IV substances include alprazolam (Xanax®), clonazepam (Klonopin®), clorazepate (Tranxene®), diazepam (Valium®), lorazepam (Ativan®), midazolam (Versed®), temazepam (Restoril®), and triazolam (Halcion®).

http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/pu...t/section5.htm

Schedule III-V Substances

A prescription for controlled substances in Schedules III, IV, and V issued by a practitioner, may be communicated either orally, in writing, or by facsimile to the pharmacist, and may be refilled if so authorized on the prescription or by call-in.

Refills

Schedule III and IV controlled substances may be refilled if authorized on the prescription. However, the prescription may only be refilled up to five times within six months after the date on which the prescription was issued. After five refills or after six months, whichever occurs first, a new prescription is required.

Facsimile Prescriptions for Schedule III-V Substances

Prescriptions for Schedules III-V controlled substances may be transmitted by facsimile from the practitioner or an employee or agent of the individual practitioner to the dispensing pharmacy. The facsimile is considered to be equivalent to an original prescription.

Telephone Authorization for Schedule III-V Prescriptions

A pharmacist may dispense a controlled substance listed in Schedule III, IV, or V pursuant to an oral prescription made by an individual practitioner and promptly reduced to writing by the pharmacist containing all information required for a valid prescription, except for the signature of the practitioner.

However, states have additional laws which govern the dispensing of controlled substances and they vary from state to state.

I suggest you ask your pharmacist about the state laws regarding the schedule IV controlled substances in your state.

Additionally, your doctor can apply schedule II restrictions to a schedule IV controlled substance if he feels more comfortable writing the prescriptions that way because it is his name on the script issuing the medication. If he only feels comfortable issuing a 30 day supply and you have to come get a refill then that is what you have to do.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by jmccracky

That is one of the reasons why I stopped taking them. Fear of getting them without an Rx and getting caught, and I've seen what they can do to people. Highly addictive. It works for panic and anxiety though. I've just said screw it and deal with my anxiety/panic attack issues. I've done the following-

1. I quit smoking cigs.

2. Cut way down on alcohol. I used to drink every day. Now, more like twice a month. Gradually been cutting back and plan to cut it out entirely.

3. Get more rest taking melatonin and Valerian root.

Not sure if it is all in my head, but before the melatonin, I was an insomniac and it seems to be working. Same with the Valerian. I would get 2 hours of sleep on a good night. Now, I can get anywhere from 4 to 9 hours. I hadn't slept for more than 6 hours in YEARS. Most of it was probably sleep apnea, but that seems to have disappeared since I quit smoking cigs and don't drink like Lindsay Lohan anymore. My fiance said I will snore at a low level now, instead of sawing logs. She said I also don't stop breathing in my sleep anymore. I can tell the difference, big time.

Committing to all three of these things has helped immensely. So, I won't even ask for any meds or Xanax at my next doctor appointment. I'll just let him know that what I've been doing has helped and maybe we can go from there.

I don't want to get into the anxiety/panic attack issue too much because 1) I don't like the field of psychiatry, 2) because I don't like it I don't think I'm particulary good at it, 3) the pharmacology of psych meds is particularly complicated and a balancing act between therapeutic usage and side effects which requires a lot of experience to master, 4) the majority of anxiety/depression patients are just whiners who just want a happy pill and make it more difficult for the patients who truly do need help to get the help they need.

Moving on.

Don't ignore the sleep apnea. The first step to improving sleep apnea is to lose weight. The majority of obstructive sleep apnea sufferers are overweight. Then talk to your doctor about getting a sleep study to determine if you need a CPAP machine. Most people think sleep apnea is no big deal, but they are surprised to learn there is a link between sleep apnea and heart arrhythmias with their associated complications. Plus sleep apnea cuts into your REM sleep and if you also suffer from insomnia you need all the REM sleep you can get. There is also an association between sleep apnea and an increased risk for car accidents due to day time sleepiness.

[silenetwolf]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

That doesn't make any sense. Klonopin is a schedule IV benzodiazepine and according to the DEA your doc can call it in or fax it. What you are describing sounds like schedule II restrictions

http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/pu...t/section2.htm



http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/pu...t/section5.htm



However, states have additional laws which govern the dispensing of controlled substances and they vary from state to state.

I suggest you ask your pharmacist about the state laws regarding the schedule IV controlled substances in your state.

Additionally, your doctor can apply schedule II restrictions to a schedule IV controlled substance if he feels more comfortable writing the prescriptions that way because it is his name on the script issuing the medication. If he only feels comfortable issuing a 30 day supply and you have to come get a refill then that is what you have to do.

I wouldn't know anything about that, I only know what he tells me. He also told me that it can be addictive. He's the psych, I am just the patient.

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

Pfft. 0.5mg vs 5mg.

Hey, what's a missplaced decimal point with a lawyer? No biggie. Right?

Seriously, how much difference could it make to take ten times the medication you are supposed to? I mean look how small a milligram is.

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

Don't do this.

Keep your xanax in its prescription bottle. If a police officer stopped you for whatever reason and found the xanax in your cigarette pack you could be arrested for possession of a controlled substance.

This is true. Even though you could get the charges dropped later by showing a valid prescription you would still probably get arrested and have to make a bond to get out of jail.

if you don't want to take the bottle with you then you need to keep proof of a valid prescription in your wallet.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by silenetwolf

I wouldn't know anything about that, I only know what he tells me. He also told me that it can be addictive. He's the psych, I am just the patient.

Well, now you know something about it because I showed you the DEA regulation regarding schedule II and schedule IV medications. I also told you to ask your pharmacist about your state regulations which could be more restrictive than the DEA regulations just to double check he isn't full of crap. Just ask your pharmacist if your doctor can issue refills on the same Klonopin prescription and if he can fax or call in the refill for you.

If your state laws aren't different than the DEA regulation then confront your doctor with the information. Let him know that you know Klonopin is schedule IV, not schedule II. And as a schedule IV medication, he can fax or call in a prescription and he can give you up to 5 refills for a six month period.

Or you can do nothing and just sit there and complain about going in every 30 days for a refill.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by fredtoast

Seriously, how much difference could it make to take ten times the medication you are supposed to? I mean look how small a milligram is.

It would depend upon the medication.

If a person took 5mg of xanax instead of 0.5mg of xanax it would result in a trip to the ER to figure out why they weren't acting right suddenly. Symptoms could include confusion, altered mental status, slurred speech, blurred vision, ataxia, etc. Then you're thinking, "Oh my God, Grandma is having a stroke! Call 911!"

But, they would determine Grandma wasn't having a stroke, she was just prescribed 10 times the amount of xanax she was supposed to take. What do you think would happen next? It rhymes with, "malpractice suit" and "out of court settlement".

Fred, if I ordered 0.3mg of epinephrine IM for an allergic reaction, but you received the same dose IV, instead of IM, it could potentially kill you.

What would happen if you got 10x the amount of heparin you were supposed to get?

What if it was 10x the amount of insulin?

What if it was 10X the amount of tegretol?

Fentanyl is dosed base upon micrograins. So what would happen if you got 100mg instead of 100mcg?

[XenoMorph]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

It would depend upon the medication.

If a person took 5mg of xanax instead of 0.5mg of xanax it would result in a trip to the ER to figure out why they weren't acting right suddenly.

Light weight,..

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by BengalsFan024

Light weight,..

I've seen trips to the ER for less.

[Morning Star]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

Here's an excerpt from the benadryl package insert...

http://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed...fo.cfm?id=1029



Be afraid. Be very, very afraid.

well I heard that some of the other allergy medicine was actually causing suicide and deppresion..I did my research..I only take benadryl when the mulberry bush is blooming late Feb or march..

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by Wingnut

It would depend upon the medication.

If a person took 5mg of xanax instead of 0.5mg of xanax it would result in a trip to the ER to figure out why they weren't acting right suddenly. Symptoms could include confusion, altered mental status, slurred speech, blurred vision, ataxia, etc. Then you're thinking, "Oh my God, Grandma is having a stroke! Call 911!"

But, they would determine Grandma wasn't having a stroke, she was just prescribed 10 times the amount of xanax she was supposed to take. What do you think would happen next? It rhymes with, "malpractice suit" and "out of court settlement".

Fred, if I ordered 0.3mg of epinephrine IM for an allergic reaction, but you received the same dose IV, instead of IM, it could potentially kill you.

What would happen if you got 10x the amount of heparin you were supposed to get?

What if it was 10x the amount of insulin?

What if it was 10X the amount of tegretol?

Fentanyl is dosed base upon micrograins. So what would happen if you got 100mg instead of 100mcg?

I was joking.

Sorry, I should have added a ninja.

[Wingnut]

Originally Posted by Morning Star

well I heard that some of the other allergy medicine was actually causing suicide and deppresion..I did my research..I only take benadryl when the mulberry bush is blooming late Feb or march..

You did your research? That's the funniest joke I've read in a long time. Thanks for the laugh. Where did you do your research? Stevequayle.com?

Suicide and depression aren't listed side effects to any of the OTC antihistamines medications and the listed side effects include effects which haven't even been proven to be caused by the medication. So I have no idea where you heard that information. Probably the same place you did your research.