New Picture of George Zimmerman Released

[BengalRugby]

It is impossible for you to massage the evidence because you do not even know what it is. Here is wht the girl said

Please notice I did not comment at all about what the girl said, so your stance is pointless. In fact, I clearly state I don't know everything. Plus it is unknown if the girl is lying, telling the truth, has changed her story, and the same can be said of Zimmerman.

Odd you can immediately assume one side's account is completely false, yet swallow the other side's lines hook, line, and sinker. So objective...



Zimmerman NEVER returned to his car. He claimed he was when he was attacked from behind and his head was pounded against the sidewalk and the confrontation only ended when he was able to pull his gun and shoot Treyvon. But Treyvon was killed forty feet from the sidewalk. None of the witnesses place the fight anywhere near the sidewalk.

In order to believe Zimmerman you have to believe that Treyvon attacked him on the sidewalk and that Zimmerman was never able to get up until they somehow moved forty feet away where he was able to draw his gun and kill Martin.

Add in the fact that Zimmerman is a a proven liar, and the story becomes even more unbelievable.


Zimmerman was returning to his vehicle when he and Treyvon re-encountered each other. Here is a link with the map as well as routes based off of the calls made and witnesses. It supports the theory Treyvon lost Zimmerman and then turned into the aggressor, doubling back and stalking him, potentially even being the instigator of the physical confrontation.

But cannot say that is absolutely what happened,as I don't have all the evidence. But is certainly is reasonable and possible.

http://www.wagist.com/2012/dan-lineh...n-doubled-back


Plus, as I noted, covering a distance of 40 feet during the course of a fight is nothing, so that claim you keep making has a foundation of sand. In fact, one might even suggest that you have no concept of what happens during a fight, as I recall you and Dabo discussing the issue and you claimed you don't get into fights, never fight, as you arfe toi smart to get into them? Therefore, one can reasonable assume that your knowledge on the subject is minimal and. Since you keep re-hashing the 40 ft claim, I am lead to believe that minimal is a fair assessment.


And of course the character attacks, which again have nothing to do with the fact that a lot of bad decisions were made on both sides. One good decision by either party and Treyvon would still be alive today. Please stay on point.

Or continue to massage evidence to paint your scenarios...

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by BengalRugby

Zimmerman was returning to his vehicle when he and Treyvon re-encountered each other. Here is a link with the map as well as routes based off of the calls made and witnesses. It supports the theory Treyvon lost Zimmerman and then turned into the aggressor, doubling back and stalking him, potentially even being the instigator of the physical confrontation..

What this map shows is that Zimmerman left the sidewalk that would have taken him back to his car and headed down between the two rows of buildings to follow Treyvon. He clearly was not on his way back to his truck when the confrontation took place.


And for all your talk about them somehow moving forty feet during the fight that is completely contradictory to what Zimmerman said in his written statement. He said that Treyvon knocked him down on the sidewalk and that he could not move until he shot Treyvon. He said that every time he tried to move Treyvon banged his head on the sidewalk again. Here is the exact statement

http://184.172.211.159/~gzdocs/docum...ement_0226.pdf

Zimmerman also says that Treyvon saw his gun. That is a pretty good reason why Treyvon chose not to just get up and try to run away. He assumed that he would be killed by this armed stalker. But amazingly even though Treyvon was on top of Zimmerman and Zimmerman was unabvle to move Treyvon was not able to get the gun before Zimmerman could unholster it, aim it at Treyvon, and shoot him in the chest. I wonder why Treyvon never tried to do anything to keep Zimmerman from shooting him?

One thing I was wrong about (it had been a while since I looked at the photos) is that there actually was a sidewalk that ran down between the buildings. I thought it was just grass.

[fredtoast]

Originally Posted by BengalRugby

It is impossible for you to massage the evidence because you do not even know what it is. Here is wht the girl said

Please notice I did not comment at all about what the girl said, so your stance is pointless.
..

Oh really?

Originally Posted by BengalRugby

Treyvon's girlfriend told him to run away,

[BengalRugby]

Oh really?

This is why it is pointless to have a discussion with you, you evade the big picture and feign little points by pulling things out of context. Red herring after red herring and look where this has gone, way off point.


Let's get it back there. I listed multiple actions that would have resulted in Treyvon being alive today. Those choices were in Treyvon's own hands.


Zimmerman too made several bad decisions that if any number were reversed, Treyvon would still be alive. It is not difficult to understand, and will not keep re-typing the same things over and over since you cannot be objective.



Like in the other portion, you claim Zimmerman to be a liar, then cite his statement as the truth in a effort to prove me wrong? If it is the truth, then Treyvon attacked him from behind as well and tried to kill him with his own gun.


You can't have it both ways, and insist on massaging evidence to suit your pre-decided verdict. Pointless to discuss the case with such a closed mind.

[gmdino]

Originally Posted by BengalRugby

Oh really?

This is why it is pointless to have a discussion with you, you evade the big picture and feign little points by pulling things out of context. Red herring after red herring and look where this has gone, way off point.


Let's get it back there. I listed multiple actions that would have resulted in Treyvon being alive today. Those choices were in Treyvon's own hands.


Zimmerman too made several bad decisions that if any number were reversed, Treyvon would still be alive. It is not difficult to understand, and will not keep re-typing the same things over and over since you cannot be objective.



Like in the other portion, you claim Zimmerman to be a liar, then cite his statement as the truth in a effort to prove me wrong? If it is the truth, then Treyvon attacked him from behind as well and tried to kill him with his own gun.


You can't have it both ways, and insist on massaging evidence to suit your pre-decided verdict. Pointless to discuss the case with such a closed mind.

And while you are correct that if he had ran off once he thought he had lost Zimmerman I have to ask: Isn't that still blaming the victim? he was being followed by a man with a gun who was trained to NOT do that exact thing. (Not that Martin knew it at the time.)

But while hypothetically he may have lived if had just ran back to the house he was staying in you could also say hypothetically that Zimmerman, seeing his "suspect" run would even MORE convinced of his guilt of something and still confronted him.

There were multiple chances for Zimmerman to avoid the whole thing too.

[browns town bengal]

Originally Posted by fredtoast

No he wouldn't.

Really? You know that for a fact do you?

Originally Posted by fredtoast

No he didn't lose Zimmerman for very long. Treyvon's phone conversation to his girlfriend is proof that Zimmerman was still following him. The fact that Zimmerman was 40 feet from the sidewalk where he claimed he was walking back to his car proves that he was still following Treyvon instead of going back to his car.

I suppose Treyvon did not want to lead this stalker back to where he lived, and I don't blame him for that. He was probably just thinking of the safety of the rest of his family.

Now I know youre an attorney. This is exactly what the prosecution would probably say to make trayvon look like some hero and further cement his role as victim. Youre speculating fred to further your agenda to make this kid out to be a saint. Why dont you just stick to the facts

[goalpost]

I do think here is a misunderstanding involved with both parties that led to this.

Treyvon was not walking on the side walk but rather walking up near the properties. My understanding is that it was raining and he was walking between residences to conceivably have some shelter. Treyvon, himself, might not have known that a 'watch person' would deem his disposition suspicious. Unfortunately everything escalates to a fight of which nobody knows, for certain, who started it, each suspicious of one another.