Who would you rather have as OC, Gruden or Jackson?

[GodFather07]

So you have one of two choices with this, who would you pick and why?

1) Jay stays for another year as OC.

2) Jay is hired as HC somewhere and the Bengals promote from within giving Hue Jackson the new position of OC.

[OMAHABENGAL54]

Hue... -6 passing in 1st half was a joke in Houston. Wouldn't mind another year but last half of season offensively was a joke. My only issue with hue is dalton might be limited in a more vertical passing game

[ExtraNirvana]

Hue I think he respects the running game more which I like. I appreciate the fact that Gruden played a lot of QB and can help Dalton in that aspect.

Its a toss up but I think Hue is who I'd roll with.

[bigbengalbuddy]

Dirty Little Secret that everybody knows, of course, is that Jay was hired because of his relationship with Brother Jon.

Maybe Hue should start claiming that he is the nephew of Uncle Phil?

LOL

[neek]

Originally Posted by bigbengalbuddy

Dirty Little Secret that everybody knows, of course, is that Jay was hired because of his relationship with Brother Jon.

Maybe Hue should start claiming that he is the nephew of Uncle Phil?

LOL

No he wasn't. Jay is alright, he'll get it right. There were some key pieces missing from that offense. We'll get them this year, and everyone will love Jay again if he stays.

[momadance02]

Hue.

[berserkerone88]

Jay gets boned over with no talent on the offense and everyone wants his head.
What a joke.

For what he has worked with, Jay has done an incredible job.
Very few offenses have less to work with overall than we do.
This isn't even a debate if Sanu stays healthy or starts over the joke experiment of Binns/Tate/Hawkins as #2 wideouts

[BengalsRocker]

Going away from the run when the run was working in some games still is puzzling.

You can argue the lack of talent or missing pieces all you want.

How do you go away from something that is working?

That's on the OC.

[Abspara]

Originally Posted by berserkerone88

Jay gets boned over with no talent on the offense and everyone wants his head.
What a joke.

For what he has worked with, Jay has done an incredible job.
Very few offenses have less to work with overall than we do.
This isn't even a debate if Sanu stays healthy or starts over the joke experiment of Binns/Tate/Hawkins as #2 wideouts

Jay regressed in year two from 20th to 22nd offense in NFL. He's not improving, he's getting worse.i dont know about you but im not exactly confident he'll improve next year.

[neek]

Originally Posted by Abspara

Jay regressed in year two from 20th to 22nd offense in NFL. He's not improving, he's getting worse.i dont know about you but im not exactly confident he'll improve next year.

Jay wasn't really given too many more weapons either. I think that this year will be the teller. If he gets the holes filled that he needs (that's what she said), and he still fails, then that's on him.

[berserkerone88]

Originally Posted by Abspara

Jay regressed in year two from 20th to 22nd offense in NFL. He's not improving, he's getting worse.i dont know about you but im not exactly confident he'll improve next year.

what would you expect from a team running Armon Binns, Brandon Tate and a 5th round rookie WR as their #2 most of the season?

[neek]

Originally Posted by berserkerone88

what would you expect from a team running Armon Binns, Brandon Tate and a 5th round rookie WR as their #2 most of the season?

Seriously. Who else thought this was a good idea aside from the Bengals Coaching staff..... Wait............ Hmmmmmmmm. Well I'm confused now. I guess Gruden didn't have the power to get who he wanted.

[gardner30]

Its on Gruden to identify his lack of WR talent in TC and bang on the table for something else.

At least play the kids sooner if he wasn't sure with Binns or Tate.

He may have asked for help at WR and MB told him no but at that point I would have played the kids right out of the gate.

I don't want any OC that doesn't incorporate the screen pass in his offense.

[berserkerone88]

Originally Posted by gardner30

Its on Gruden to identify his lack of WR talent in TC and bang on the table for something else.

At least play the kids sooner if he wasn't sure with Binns or Tate.

He may have asked for help at WR and MB told him no but at that point I would have played the kids right out of the gate.

I don't want any OC that doesn't incorporate the screen pass in his offense.

He can identify it all he wants
It is up to Mike Brown to sign the checks in the end.

We did run the screen. Many times. Especially to AJ and Hawkins.
We didn't run the RB screen because our RB are slow.

[Ryan Mc]

Originally Posted by berserkerone88

Jay gets boned over with no talent on the offense and everyone wants his head.
What a joke.

For what he has worked with, Jay has done an incredible job.
Very few offenses have less to work with overall than we do.
This isn't even a debate if Sanu stays healthy or starts over the joke experiment of Binns/Tate/Hawkins as #2 wideouts

I strongly disagree. Gruden has one of the best WRs in the game, a solid O-line with excellent bookend tackles, a good pass-catching TE and a QB that he supposedly hand-picked from the 2011 draft pool (anybody want to go back to the 35th pick that year and take Kaepernick instead?). As for #2 WR, that problem is exaggerated. If you look at the 'west coast' offense it is often the case that the top three receivers are #1 WR followed by TE then RB. The ball is supposed to be spread around, and it is pretty common for the #2 WR in the west coast offense to be no higher than the 4th most productive receiver on the roster, sometimes even 5th most behind a slot/3rd down WR. I admit that the talent at #2 WR was limited and the play was spotty, but that should not have been such a big issue in a well-run west coast offense.

We were a bad offense and regressed more and more as the season went on ... Gruden should be out IMO.

[berserkerone88]

Originally Posted by Ryan Mc

I strongly disagree. Gruden has one of the best WRs in the game, a solid O-line with excellent bookend tackles, a good pass-catching TE and a QB that he supposedly hand-picked from the 2011 draft pool (anybody want to go back to the 35th pick that year and take Kaepernick instead?). As for #2 WR, that problem is exaggerated. If you look at the 'west coast' offense it is often the case that the top three receivers are #1 WR followed by TE then RB. The ball is supposed to be spread around, and it is pretty common for the #2 WR in the west coast offense to be no higher than the 4th most productive receiver on the roster, sometimes even 5th most behind a slot/3rd down WR. I admit that the talent at #2 WR was limited and the play was spotty, but that should not have been such a big issue in a well-run west coast offense.

We were a bad offense and regressed more and more as the season went on ... Gruden should be out IMO.

Lol.
Yeah **** him. He couldn't succeed with one WR.
And that pass catching TE who couldn't catch anything in the playoffs.
Yeah. Jay's fault.

[Ryan Mc]

Originally Posted by berserkerone88

Lol.
Yeah **** him. He couldn't succeed with one WR.
And that pass catching TE who couldn't catch anything in the playoffs.
Yeah. Jay's fault.

We were 22nd in offense and I don't think there are 21 teams in the NFL with better offensive talent than us. In the final 6 games of the season we scored only 7 offensive TDs, and even SIX of those came after defense or special teams set us up with field position in the opponents half of the season. We were a pretty bad offensive team last year, especially down the stretch. Personally, I don't think our offensive talent was weak enough to excuse this performance (although your childish sarcasm was very persuasive)

[berserkerone88]

Originally Posted by Ryan Mc

We were 22nd in offense and I don't think there are 21 teams in the NFL with better offensive talent than us. In the final 6 games of the season we scored only 7 offensive TDs, and even SIX of those came after defense or special teams set us up with field position in the opponents half of the season. We were a pretty bad offensive team last year, especially down the stretch. Personally, I don't think our offensive talent was weak enough to excuse this performance (although your childish sarcasm was very persuasive)

There may not be twenty one, but there sure as hell are a lot more.
We had one offensive weapon who was even remotely consistent in Green.

Outside of that, nothing.

(although your willingness to blind yourself on how untalented the offense was persuasive)

[Ryan Mc]

Originally Posted by berserkerone88

...(although your willingness to blind yourself on how untalented the offense was persuasive)

Actually, my original post does contain an argument for why I think that Gruden did have the talent at hand to do better than he did. So far, you haven't actually refuted or contradicted anything specific I said in that post.

[GodFather07]

I think its funny that a year ago how many people wanted Gruden to be our head coach and this year alot of the same people don't even want him on the team.

I voted for Gruden and think he deserves another year to see what he will do with this team. He didn't call the greatest game against the Texans thats for sure, but it didn't help having receivers dropping too many passes and a QB playing god awful from beginning to end.

If the calls stayed the way they were last year and the players made the plays they were SUPPOSED to make we would've been playing this weekend.

[Ryan Mc]

Originally Posted by GodFather07

I think its funny that a year ago how many people wanted Gruden to be our head coach and this year alot of the same people don't even want him on the team.

I voted for Gruden and think he deserves another year to see what he will do with this team. He didn't call the greatest game against the Texans thats for sure, but it didn't help having receivers dropping too many passes and a QB playing god awful from beginning to end.

If the calls stayed the way they were last year and the players made the plays they were SUPPOSED to make we would've been playing this weekend.

But, it's more than just the Texans game though ... it's not just a kneejerk reaction to that one game. Over the final 6 games we scored only 7 offensive TDs, and even then 6 of those came after special teams or defense set up the offense with field position inside the opponent's half of the field. In the final six games we literally only had one offensive possession (the opening drive against Dallas) where we took possession of the ball in our own half of the field and drove it down into the opponent's endzone. That's fairly amazing futility for an offense.

[bonesaw]

The Jay hating is still baffling me. We finished right where we should have on offense. Jay can't make blocks or make Gresham and crew catch. He can't make Dalton not miss throws. Our problems on offense are player execution problems, not scheme or design problems. Time for the players to put their big boy pants on.

[Bull Durham]

Originally Posted by BengalsRocker

Going away from the run when the run was working in some games still is puzzling.

You can argue the lack of talent or missing pieces all you want.

How do you go away from something that is working?

That's on the OC.

We didn't. The only time the running game worked was when the other team wasn't expecting it. Whenever we tried to stick with it, it was like running into a brick wall.

[Bull Durham]

Originally Posted by Ryan Mc

We were 22nd in offense and I don't think there are 21 teams in the NFL with better offensive talent than us. In the final 6 games of the season we scored only 7 offensive TDs, and even SIX of those came after defense or special teams set us up with field position in the opponents half of the season. We were a pretty bad offensive team last year, especially down the stretch. Personally, I don't think our offensive talent was weak enough to excuse this performance (although your childish sarcasm was very persuasive)

Dude, there are about 30 teams with better offensive talent. I think you're a little delusional about the talent level on this offense. Our personnel was really poor this season.

[Big D from logan]

I WOULD love to see Jay go. He is too predictable and too many times we would have three receivers in the same place. He never made adjustments to what the defense was doing and killed us by not running the ball when it was working. when he did not have a game plan with AJ in it done me. Jay should have been fired as soon as the game was over.