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  #376  
Old 01-21-2013, 03:31 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Originally Posted by BengalYankee View Post
Ok since the ****ing draft then
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  #377  
Old 01-21-2013, 03:41 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Originally Posted by BengalYankee View Post
The homers here will always have an excuse of saying Dalton > Colin.

If you are going to use OL, RB, OC, Kickers and Punters as excuses for Dalton than stop comparing any QB with any other QB. Stop comparing Brady with Peyton. Don't compare Jamarcus Russell with Rodgers. Rodgers had great weapons, Jamarcus did not. Rodgers has a great HC and Jamarcus never did. Of course these are silly excuses and outside of Bengal Land, people would make fun of you if you said you prefer Dalton over Colin.

At this moment, the whole world knows that Colin >>> Dalton. Stop making excuses!!!!!
So we can't talk about personnel or system differences? Then how are we supposed to truly compare them?

1. Kaep would not be playing in a gimmick pistol system here. Instead of using Kaep's strengths, we would surely try to fit a square peg in a round hole.

2. Kaep would have to run less and throw more here. I don't think anyone would debate that. Marv wouldn't put in a gimmick offense and let Kaep run 10-15 times.

3. SF is no doubt a better team than the Bengals.

If we're just blindly comparing how the QBs are playing, then sure I'll take Kaep. I just don't think he'd be playing like this for us. Not in our system with our line and receivers. I think if we'd drafted Kaep, we'd be looking at Dalton in SF and wishing we had him.
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  #378  
Old 01-21-2013, 03:55 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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So we can't talk about personnel or system differences? Then how are we supposed to truly compare them?

1. Kaep would not be playing in a gimmick pistol system here. Instead of using Kaep's strengths, we would surely try to fit a square peg in a round hole.

2. Kaep would have to run less and throw more here. I don't think anyone would debate that.

3. SF is no doubt a better team than the Bengals.

If we're just blindly comparing how the QBs are playing, then sure I'll take Kaep. I just don't think he'd be playing like this for us. Not in our system with our line and receivers. I think if we'd drafted Kaep, we'd be looking at Dalton in SF and wishing we had him.
Members here can't have it both ways. That is called hypocrisy. You can't compare Dalton with Cam and not want to compare Dalton with Colin.

Comparing Cam vs Dalton, neglecting the fact that outside of Cam, the Bengals are a far superior team then the Panthers. Yet that is what the members did last year. The emphasis was who got farther Dalton or Cam. Now that Colin has gotten his team to the SB, people are now saying they have the better OC, OL, etc.

Look, I hate the 49ers with a passion and I was pulling for Atlanta and Green Bay last week. But all of America, well most of America knows that Colin is a better QB at this point. To deny that is stupid.

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  #379  
Old 01-21-2013, 07:44 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

Seeing how weak the NFC was in 2012, the 49ers would have still been in the Super Bowl with Alex Smith at quarterback.
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  #380  
Old 01-21-2013, 09:28 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Seeing how weak the NFC was in 2012, the 49ers would have still been in the Super Bowl with Alex Smith at quarterback.
You made me laugh this morning.....this is just........garbage.
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  #381  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:03 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Seeing how weak the NFC was in 2012, the 49ers would have still been in the Super Bowl with Alex Smith at quarterback.
I don't even know where to start with that statement

The NFC was weak???

Atlanta was 4-0 in the AFC including a beat down of Denver.
Tampa Bay was 3-1 in the AFC.
Green Bay, Vikings and Bears were 3-1 against the AFC
Seattle and Dallas were 3-1
and of course the 49ers were 4-0.

Let's look at it the this way only the Giants, Lions and Rams had losing records of 1-3 against the AFC.

OR

Only the Bengals, Steelers, Colts and Denver had 3-1 records against the NFC, no team was 4-0 against the NFC and 4 teams was 0-4 against the NFC. No teams of the NFC went winless against the AFC. Sorry, I like you, but your last statement was Fail.
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  #382  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:05 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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The Kaepernick bandwagon starts here then. I never heard anybody saying they wanted him over Dalton before this week. silly fans are silly.
Use the search function. Type 'Colin' and narrow the search to the draft forum. Then look at threads from 2011.
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  #383  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:07 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Ok since the ****ing draft then
Probably because he did not play last year.
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  #384  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:16 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

Here's my honest assessment: I can't stand Colin Kaepernick, I think Jim Harbaugh is an overrated drama queen, and I can't stomach anything about San Francisco. Kaepernick is a gimmick player running a college offense in the NFL which is appropriate because it's all Jim Harbaugh knows. He's an inked-up freak whose popularity is propped up by America's sick obsession with pop culture. Kaepernick is one hard hit away from becoming Robert Griffin III and I hope he learns to slide and protect himself before Bernard Pollard lays him out like Stevan Ridley.
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  #385  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:20 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

The biggest difference is that we didn't scout kaepernick, how could we since we didn't have more than 1 total scout until this coming off season.

There is a reason SF has 5 Superbowls with a 6th one probable and we are 0-2, just like Dalton in the playoffs.

Count on 0% chance of the Bengals winning a Superbowl until Mike Brown is no longer in charge of the organization. His system of spend the least possible on all pieces of the organization hasn't worked in almost 25 years, what makes us think the next 10 year of that system will be any different?

The NFL has shifted to quarterbacks with either mobility combined with solid passing ability or elite passing ability (maybe 5 QB's having this elite passing quality right now) as defenses have gotten lighter and faster. We have a barely above average QB with a weaker arm and questionable accuracy/decision making skills combined with an offensive line that isn't built to play with fast DE's and sneaky linebackers. Yeah, we have a great shot at actually bringing home a championship anytime soon....
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  #386  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:25 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Here's my honest assessment: I can't stand Colin Kaepernick, I think Jim Harbaugh is an overrated drama queen, and I can't stomach anything about San Francisco. Kaepernick is a gimmick player running a college offense in the NFL which is appropriate because it's all Jim Harbaugh knows. He's an inked-up freak whose popularity is propped up by America's sick obsession with pop culture. Kaepernick is one hard hit away from becoming Robert Griffin III and I hope he learns to slide and protect himself before Bernard Pollard lays him out like Stevan Ridley.
Like what Bernard did to Brady.

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  #387  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:31 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

There is something to be said for there needing to be an adjustment period for defenses to figure out a new QB. Also, Colin didn't get thrown into the fire day one. If he had been, you wonder who would have more wins right now. Don't get me wrong, I like CK and hope he has a solid career, but even if he wins the SB this year the book on what his future is hasn't been written yet.
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  #388  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:38 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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So we can't talk about personnel or system differences? Then how are we supposed to truly compare them?

1. Kaep would not be playing in a gimmick pistol system here. Instead of using Kaep's strengths, we would surely try to fit a square peg in a round hole.

2. Kaep would have to run less and throw more here. I don't think anyone would debate that. Marv wouldn't put in a gimmick offense and let Kaep run 10-15 times.

3. SF is no doubt a better team than the Bengals.

If we're just blindly comparing how the QBs are playing, then sure I'll take Kaep. I just don't think he'd be playing like this for us. Not in our system with our line and receivers. I think if we'd drafted Kaep, we'd be looking at Dalton in SF and wishing we had him.

Yep. The CK crowd refuses to acknowledge:

-Throwing 24 times a game is different than throwing 34+.
-SF has a better line and running game.
-Not starting year 1 is an advantage.
-A bust qb like Alex Smith looked good in that system and actually had a higher rating than CK. I doubt that Gradkowski would outplay Dalton.
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  #389  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:42 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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There is something to be said for there needing to be an adjustment period for defenses to figure out a new QB. Also, Colin didn't get thrown into the fire day one. If he had been, you wonder who would have more wins right now. Don't get me wrong, I like CK and hope he has a solid career, but even if he wins the SB this year the book on what his future is hasn't been written yet.

Wasn't there a lockout last year? Didn't Dalton get thrown into the fire without having proper mentoring last year? The defenses did not have much on Dalton last year either. Nobody knew anything about nobody last year, because of the lockout.
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  #390  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:42 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Yeah, we have seen this show with Tarkenton, Staubauch, Elway, Steve Grogan, Bobby Douglass and Steve Young, guys like that ....

And are any of those guys as lanky as CK?
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  #391  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Yep. The CK crowd refuses to acknowledge:

-Throwing 24 times a game is different than throwing 34+.
-SF has a better line and running game.
-Not starting year 1 is an advantage.
-A bust qb like Alex Smith looked good in that system and actually had a higher rating than CK. I doubt that Gradkowski would outplay Dalton.

Then don't ever compare any QB's. Be consistent.

I hate the 49ers and I always hope that Colin has a horrible day. But I know what I see. Just like America, knows what they see and if you are going to tell people outside of Bengal land that Dalton is better then Colin, get ready to be laughed at.
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  #392  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:48 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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And are any of those guys as lanky as CK?

None of them has the muscles as Colin has and Colin has a better bod then most of them
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  #393  
Old 01-21-2013, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Then don't ever compare any QB's. Be consistent.

I hate the 49ers and I always hope that Colin has a horrible day. But I know what I see. Just like America, knows what they see and if you are going to tell people outside of Bengal land that Dalton is better then Colin, get ready to be laughed at.
And did you see career bust Alex Smith shine in that offense and actually have a higher rating than CK this year?

CK took over a team that was in the NFC championship game last year. Its not lie he's doing this on a 3-13 team.
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  #394  
Old 01-21-2013, 11:02 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Half a season inheriting a team that was a muffed punt away from the Super Bowl last year.

The fact that this thread has gone on this long leads me to believe that most of the people on these boards aren't as smart as I originally thought they were.

Keapernick's luck> Dalton's luck.

Dalton's skills, intangibles, and potential>Kaepernick's everything.
You're out of your mind. CK is better in every area. There is nothing that Dalton does better than CK. Nothing. Let;s go through a list of QB measureables:

Size: CK
Escapability: CK
Arm strength: CK
Pocket Poise: CK
Deep Ball Accuracy: CK
Intermediate Ball Accuracy: CK
Ability to make correct read: CK
Ability to play big in big games: CK

Really, it's not even close. What, specifically, do you think Dalton does better? Or are you going to put everything on 'luck' or say that the niners have a better O-line?
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

If they switched places, would CK be as successful on the Bengals?
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  #396  
Old 01-21-2013, 11:16 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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If they switched places, would CK be as successful on the Bengals?
That's the perfect question -- and the answer is no. However, Andy Dalton would be a smashing success in San Francisco.

Has anyone read Pat Kirwan's book Take Your Eye Off the Ball: How to Watch Football by Knowing Where to Look yet? This is a brilliant piece of work because it gives the reader an insight into the guts of football, specifically the offensive line play and how it enables running and passing. Pat opened my eyes with this book and with co-authors like Pete Carroll and Bill Cowher, the credibility is all over the place. I now see games differently than I did and I appreciate the "violent ballet" of those men in the trenches.
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:18 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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That's the perfect question -- and the answer is no. However, Andy Dalton would be a smashing success in San Francisco.

Has anyone read Pat Kirwan's book Take Your Eye Off the Ball: How to Watch Football by Knowing Where to Look yet? This is a brilliant piece of work because it gives the reader an insight into the guts of football, specifically the offensive line play and how it enables running and passing. Pat opened my eyes with this book and with co-authors like Pete Carroll and Bill Cowher, the credibility is all over the place. I now see games differently than I did and I appreciate the "violent ballet" of those men in the trenches.

Yeah, it's definitely all about line play
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  #398  
Old 01-21-2013, 11:20 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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If they switched places, would CK be as successful on the Bengals?
The Bengals offense would instantly be better. We would have a QB that defenses feared. They would have to respect his ability outside the pocket which would open up the offense. CK is also a much better passer than Dalton and able to put the ball into the tightest of windows. So who knows if the Bengals would be SB bound...I can tell you that I think the Bengals easily beat the texans with CK.
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:20 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Originally Posted by Fan_in_Kettering View Post
Here's my honest assessment: I can't stand Colin Kaepernick, I think Jim Harbaugh is an overrated drama queen, and I can't stomach anything about San Francisco. Kaepernick is a gimmick player running a college offense in the NFL which is appropriate because it's all Jim Harbaugh knows. He's an inked-up freak whose popularity is propped up by America's sick obsession with pop culture. Kaepernick is one hard hit away from becoming Robert Griffin III and I hope he learns to slide and protect himself before Bernard Pollard lays him out like Stevan Ridley.
Couple questions here:
1. How is the pistol a gimmick offense? A gimmick offense is something that can only work in special instances. Even Peyton Manning was using the pistol later in the year this year. The pistol is a great offense. You can't play 2 deep safeties because the running game will kill you, especially when both running threats are there so much that the DE freezes every QB read and Gore/James can run free. If you load up the box, Kaepernick will kill you with his great accuracy on one on one matchups. You know what else was considered a gimmick before? The passing game in general, the air coryell, the WCO, the Erdhart-Perkins, the 3-4, the Tampa-2, and basically everything that isn't running the ball today. The read system in the pistol is just the basic part of the QB bootleg, except with a higher probability of spreading the defense out. They are running an offense that goes towards his QBs strengths (which are many). This offense runs on Dalton's strengths, but those physical attributes are incredibly limited.

2. Why would you hate Kaepernick? You sound like you want him to be hurt, which is awful, and act like his tattoos are anything. He's a high character person, Christian (If that affects you at all), and he's a leader of his team. He runs the most diverse offensive system in the league with full control over audibles, line calls, and does all of this with ease.
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:21 AM
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Default Re: Dalton vs Kaepernick (20/20)

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Yeah, it's definitely all about line play
Actually its all about the QB...
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