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  #1  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:34 PM
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Default Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

Cuts:

CB Jason Allen - $4,200,000
DE Jamaal Anderson - $2,500,000

Offseason signings:

DE Michael Johnson
RT Andre Smith
DE Wallace Gilberry
P Kevin Huber
DT Pat Sims
LB Thomas Howard
K Josh Brown
CB Adam Jones
CB Terence Newman
ST Cedric Peerman
ST Jeromy Miles
ST Dan Skuta
DE Robert Geathers (If cheap)

Free Agency/Trades:

TRADE WR Darius Heyward-Bey - Hear me out on this one. The Raiders are in salary cap hell, and they need to unload. Heyward-Bey hasn't quite lived up to the #7 pick, but it's because the Raiders are using him as a #1 receiver, when he should be a #2. He's the fastest receiver in the NFL, he's only one year older than AJ, and will finally give us something deep instead of Green. Has a ton of good football ahead of him. Give them a 5th, and a conditional 2014 pick based on performance. Raiders have made it clear that they're open to trades for their WRs.

CB Mike Jenkins - Was the Cowboys' best cornerback a couple of years ago, but has since been replaced. Still pretty young, and has a lot of talent to work with. Replaces Allen.

QB Drew Stanton - Andy's new backup.


2013 NFL Draft:


1.21 Trade with Atlanta Falcons :::: Falcons trade #30, #92 to Cincinnati for #21 overall. Falcons select DE Alex Okafor, Texas.

1.30. WLB Arthur Brown, Kansas State - 6'1 230lbs
Will rise before the draft. Lacks ideal size, but more than makes up with it with his style of play. Great coverage skills, and loves to hit. 100 tackles, 2 interceptions, and 6 pass deflections in 2012. Better version of Lavonte David from the Bucs.

2.37. RB Eddie Lacy, Alabama - 6'1 220lbs
He might not be a "change of pace back", but I believe he's the future of our running back position. Doesn't have breakaway speed, but has elite vision, and great power. I like Green-Ellis, but he's made to be a short yardage back, not a feature back. Lacy can do it all, and he's built to last in the AFCN.

2.53. S Tony Jefferson - 5'11 215lbs
Reggie Nelson was fantastic this year in my opinion, but we still lack someone opposite of him. I'm sick of the band-aid pickups like Mays and Crocker, I want a starter. I've been high on Jefferson for a while, and I think his style of play will be perfect for this defense.

3.84. OT Chris Faulk, LSU - 6'6 325lbs
Was projected to be a first-round pick in preseason, but suffered a knee injury that sidelined him for the year. Would be a great guy to groom behind Whitworth as his eventual replacement, and has almost an identical frame to Whit.

3.92. RB Andre Ellington, Clemson - 5'10 190lbs
Before you bring up the fact that I just selected a running back, go back to last draft where we selected DTs in consecutive round. If you've got a hole, fix it. Ellington is the change of pace back we need, and he's expected to run in the high 4.3, low 4.4 range.

4.130. DE Lavar Edwards, LSU - 6'4 260lbs
Sort of got stuck behind Mingo and Montgomery at LSU, but still managed to pull some playing time out, and recorded 4.5 sacks this past season. Outplayed Montgomery and Mingo on a few occasions, and got some good reviews at the senior bowl. Still underrated, but would be a steal here.

6. OG Earl Watford, James Madison - 6'4 300lbs
We need some depth at RG right now. Behind Zeitler, is Trevor Robinson, who just might be playing center next season. Watford played well at the senior bowl, and should give us something to work with behind Zeitler.

6. TE/FB Mychael Rivera - Tennessee - 6'3 240lbs
Kind of an interesting pick. Plays TE at Tennessee, but I think he could be used as a fullback in the NFL. Chris Pressley is a good blocker, but he gives us nothing in the passing game. Rivera went off against Missouri this season for 123 yards and a TD.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:22 AM
Hammerstripes Hammerstripes is offline
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

If you're going to pay a WR $7 million per year, it sure as heck isn't going to be Darius Heyward-Bey. That would be one of the dumbest moves this franchise could make.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:27 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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If you're going to pay a WR $7 million per year, it sure as heck isn't going to be Darius Heyward-Bey. That would be one of the dumbest moves this franchise could make.
I think we could sign Hartline for less than that.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:31 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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I think we could sign Hartline for less than that.
He's not the guy we need on the other side either.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:33 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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He's not the guy we need on the other side either.
no but we could get him for less than that is what i'm saying.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:36 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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no but we could get him for less than that is what i'm saying.
One would think so, but I wouldn't be shocked if he got more. It seems that teams really overpay for guys in free agency.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:15 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by Hammerstripes View Post
If you're going to pay a WR $7 million per year, it sure as heck isn't going to be Darius Heyward-Bey. That would be one of the dumbest moves this franchise could make.
You'd obviously have to re-structure a deal. I'm sure he'd be willing to just to get out of Oakland.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:18 AM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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You'd obviously have to re-structure a deal. I'm sure he'd be willing to just to get out of Oakland.
It depends on how much of that is guaranteed money. I'd rather take a chance on bringing in Randy Moss to provide somewhat of a deep threat than I would giving that kind of money to a guy that flat out stinks.
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:51 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

Back to the mock...

I wouldn't mind trading down at all. Do you think Brown could play SAM if Howard's healthy?

I don't see Marvin or anyone wanting to replace BJGE after what he did by himself. Obviously he's not the best but he'll get you production. If you only want him on short yardage, we would be paying him more than what he would be worth. Besides, he's still with us for another 2 years unless he ***** it up this year.
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:07 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

That mock-up FA looks wonderful. The trade for DHB...meh. Lotta contingencies.

Just wondering, why the sudden fascination with Brown? Did he light up the senior bowl? I didn't watch, but didn't hear about him either. I've heard him called a poor man's Lavonte David, and that seems accurate. If only there was a Bobby Wagner in this draft...Minter might be the guy to grab!
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:17 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by TGISunday View Post
That mock-up FA looks wonderful. The trade for DHB...meh. Lotta contingencies.

Just wondering, why the sudden fascination with Brown? Did he light up the senior bowl? I didn't watch, but didn't hear about him either. I've heard him called a poor man's Lavonte David, and that seems accurate. If only there was a Bobby Wagner in this draft...Minter might be the guy to grab!
He didn't actually play at the Senior Bowl, he got injured, but he showed up and apparently was one of the leaders there. Cheered his teammates on all week, and scouts loved it. If I'm being super honest, his size turned me away until a couple of weeks ago when I seriously started watching his film. I felt like an idiot for not noticing him earlier.

I was really impressed that he showed up to the Senior Bowl injured, and stayed to help lead the team. Shows a lot of character.


Yeah, the DHB trade has a lot of different possible outcomes, but I really do like him as a #2. I just don't think he's in a good situation in Oakland, and if we could re-structure something here, we could have a 25 year old #2 that runs a 4.25 40. Wouldn't be upset with a draft pick either though.

Thanks for the input guys, appreciate it.
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:45 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

Instead of trading for Bey and drafting a WR in the first, why not use the same amount of cash to make an offer to Bowe, who is better than Bey and a bigger contributor than Bey and a drafted WR combined?


Plus the Bengals have enough young WR's, so why draft another when one solid vet would right the ship? Maybe replace that pick with another solid coverage linebacker. Would be a wise move to have two LB's who are solid in coverage, as the copycat league will likely start offering more offenses with 2 receiving TE's soon.


I don't like Lacy as he has the same limiting factor as Green and doesn't have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL. Thus the d-line can cheat inside and shut down his game. I agree in addressing the need early, but the RB selected needs more speed than Lacy displays.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:04 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by BengalRugby View Post
Instead of trading for Bey and drafting a WR in the first, why not use the same amount of cash to make an offer to Bowe, who is better than Bey and a bigger contributor than Bey and a drafted WR combined?


Plus the Bengals have enough young WR's, so why draft another when one solid vet would right the ship? Maybe replace that pick with another solid coverage linebacker. Would be a wise move to have two LB's who are solid in coverage, as the copycat league will likely start offering more offenses with 2 receiving TE's soon.


I don't like Lacy as he has the same limiting factor as Green and doesn't have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL. Thus the d-line can cheat inside and shut down his game. I agree in addressing the need early, but the RB selected needs more speed than Lacy displays.
Agreed on all fronts.

I'd like a vet. DHB is just coming into his talent, but I don't know if he has the veteran savvy we need.

And I like Lacy, but he doesn't seem to beat guys in straight line speed or around the corner. However, BJGE isn't even close to this guy in terms of talent. GE was a late round pick that worked well in NE's system...Lacy is the premiere bruiser back of his class; they basically specialize in the same thing, but GE is nowhere near as good as Lacy's potential.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:14 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Agreed on all fronts.

I'd like a vet. DHB is just coming into his talent, but I don't know if he has the veteran savvy we need.

And I like Lacy, but he doesn't seem to beat guys in straight line speed or around the corner. However, BJGE isn't even close to this guy in terms of talent. GE was a late round pick that worked well in NE's system...Lacy is the premiere bruiser back of his class; they basically specialize in the same thing, but GE is nowhere near as good as Lacy's potential.

bjge was an udfa
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:30 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibengals View Post
Cuts:

CB Jason Allen - $4,200,000
DE Jamaal Anderson - $2,500,000

Offseason signings:

DE Michael Johnson
RT Andre Smith
DE Wallace Gilberry
P Kevin Huber
DT Pat Sims
LB Thomas Howard
K Josh Brown
CB Adam Jones
CB Terence Newman
ST Cedric Peerman
ST Jeromy Miles
ST Dan Skuta
DE Robert Geathers (If cheap)

Free Agency/Trades:

TRADE WR Darius Heyward-Bey - Hear me out on this one. The Raiders are in salary cap hell, and they need to unload. Heyward-Bey hasn't quite lived up to the #7 pick, but it's because the Raiders are using him as a #1 receiver, when he should be a #2. He's the fastest receiver in the NFL, he's only one year older than AJ, and will finally give us something deep instead of Green. Has a ton of good football ahead of him. Give them a 5th, and a conditional 2014 pick based on performance. Raiders have made it clear that they're open to trades for their WRs.

CB Mike Jenkins - Was the Cowboys' best cornerback a couple of years ago, but has since been replaced. Still pretty young, and has a lot of talent to work with. Replaces Allen.

QB Drew Stanton - Andy's new backup.


2013 NFL Draft:


1.21 Trade with Atlanta Falcons :::: Falcons trade #30, #92 to Cincinnati for #21 overall. Falcons select DE Alex Okafor, Texas.

1.30. WLB Arthur Brown, Kansas State - 6'1 230lbs
Will rise before the draft. Lacks ideal size, but more than makes up with it with his style of play. Great coverage skills, and loves to hit. 100 tackles, 2 interceptions, and 6 pass deflections in 2012. Better version of Lavonte David from the Bucs.

2.37. RB Eddie Lacy, Alabama - 6'1 220lbs
He might not be a "change of pace back", but I believe he's the future of our running back position. Doesn't have breakaway speed, but has elite vision, and great power. I like Green-Ellis, but he's made to be a short yardage back, not a feature back. Lacy can do it all, and he's built to last in the AFCN.

2.53. S Tony Jefferson - 5'11 215lbs
Reggie Nelson was fantastic this year in my opinion, but we still lack someone opposite of him. I'm sick of the band-aid pickups like Mays and Crocker, I want a starter. I've been high on Jefferson for a while, and I think his style of play will be perfect for this defense.

3.84. OT Chris Faulk, LSU - 6'6 325lbs
Was projected to be a first-round pick in preseason, but suffered a knee injury that sidelined him for the year. Would be a great guy to groom behind Whitworth as his eventual replacement, and has almost an identical frame to Whit.

3.92. RB Andre Ellington, Clemson - 5'10 190lbs
Before you bring up the fact that I just selected a running back, go back to last draft where we selected DTs in consecutive round. If you've got a hole, fix it. Ellington is the change of pace back we need, and he's expected to run in the high 4.3, low 4.4 range.

4.130. DE Lavar Edwards, LSU - 6'4 260lbs
Sort of got stuck behind Mingo and Montgomery at LSU, but still managed to pull some playing time out, and recorded 4.5 sacks this past season. Outplayed Montgomery and Mingo on a few occasions, and got some good reviews at the senior bowl. Still underrated, but would be a steal here.

6. OG Earl Watford, James Madison - 6'4 300lbs
We need some depth at RG right now. Behind Zeitler, is Trevor Robinson, who just might be playing center next season. Watford played well at the senior bowl, and should give us something to work with behind Zeitler.

6. TE/FB Mychael Rivera - Tennessee - 6'3 240lbs
Kind of an interesting pick. Plays TE at Tennessee, but I think he could be used as a fullback in the NFL. Chris Pressley is a good blocker, but he gives us nothing in the passing game. Rivera went off against Missouri this season for 123 yards and a TD.
I could live with Arthur Brown but if you're going to draft two players from the same position it should be linebacker where we need more replacements and backups.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:39 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by BengalRugby View Post
Instead of trading for Bey and drafting a WR in the first, why not use the same amount of cash to make an offer to Bowe, who is better than Bey and a bigger contributor than Bey and a drafted WR combined?


Plus the Bengals have enough young WR's, so why draft another when one solid vet would right the ship? Maybe replace that pick with another solid coverage linebacker. Would be a wise move to have two LB's who are solid in coverage, as the copycat league will likely start offering more offenses with 2 receiving TE's soon.


I don't like Lacy as he has the same limiting factor as Green and doesn't have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL. Thus the d-line can cheat inside and shut down his game. I agree in addressing the need early, but the RB selected needs more speed than Lacy displays.
I didn't draft a WR in the first, I drafted a linebacker.....

I also think you're overrating Bowe a little bit. He had 800 yards, and 3 TDs as a #1 receiver. He might be better than DHB, but he's also a lot less likely to leave KC considering they're $16M under the cap; $22M if they release Cassel.

Sure, I could approach FA and say: RB Reggie Bush, LB Daryl Smith, WR Dwayne Bowe, SS Jairus Byrd, but I'm trying to be a little realistic.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:47 PM
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I could live with Arthur Brown but if you're going to draft two players from the same position it should be linebacker where we need more replacements and backups.
I agree that the most compelling argument can be made to add 2 LBs. Especially considering there are 3 LBs on the field at the same time and typically 7 in the 53 man roster.

But considering later round value, I can easily see how drafting 2 RBs can be a major upgrade to our existing RB corp. In addition, a similar argument could be made for the Safety corp as well.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:52 PM
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I agree that the most compelling argument can be made to add 2 LBs. Especially considering there are 3 LBs on the field at the same time and typically 7 in the 53 man roster.

But considering later round value, I can easily see how drafting 2 RBs can be a major upgrade to our existing RB corp. In addition, a similar argument could be made for the Safety corp as well.
I might get some **** for this, but we were the #6 defense in football with Maualuga and Lawson at LB..... If we upgrade at all, we're going to be top-3. If Howard isn't re-signed, I'd be absolutely on board with drafting a couple linebackers early, but I don't see it right now is all.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by BengalRugby View Post
Instead of trading for Bey and drafting a WR in the first, why not use the same amount of cash to make an offer to Bowe, who is better than Bey and a bigger contributor than Bey and a drafted WR combined?


Plus the Bengals have enough young WR's, so why draft another when one solid vet would right the ship? Maybe replace that pick with another solid coverage linebacker. Would be a wise move to have two LB's who are solid in coverage, as the copycat league will likely start offering more offenses with 2 receiving TE's soon.


I don't like Lacy as he has the same limiting factor as Green and doesn't have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL. Thus the d-line can cheat inside and shut down his game. I agree in addressing the need early, but the RB selected needs more speed than Lacy displays.
I think a lot of people have it seriously wrong on the speed concept of a HB.

Its not all about straight line speed. If a guy can break tackles like Lacy does he has an advantage.

Doug Martin 4.5 and Alfred Morris 4.67 sure had good years. And they don't have the speed of Lamar Miller and Chris Rainey who had lousy years.

Just because a guy is fast doesn't make him better. A well rounded HB has got to be tough, be able to break tackles, be able to pass block, catch, and preferably have good size. Lacy has it all.

If Lacy runs a 4.5 like many suspect he has plenty of speed.

Arian Foster ran a 4.69 at his pro day. Does he no have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL?
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:44 PM
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Back to the mock...

I wouldn't mind trading down at all. Do you think Brown could play SAM if Howard's healthy?

I don't see Marvin or anyone wanting to replace BJGE after what he did by himself. Obviously he's not the best but he'll get you production. If you only want him on short yardage, we would be paying him more than what he would be worth. Besides, he's still with us for another 2 years unless he ***** it up this year.
I have no problem saying this...our offensive linehad everything to to with every rushing yard gained by BJGE. Only reason he did it by himself is becuase no one else ran the ball for us. Bjge is bad, slow, done. Gimme a back who can replace him.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:46 PM
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I think a lot of people have it seriously wrong on the speed concept of a HB.

Its not all about straight line speed. If a guy can break tackles like Lacy does he has an advantage.

Doug Martin 4.5 and Alfred Morris 4.67 sure had good years. And they don't have the speed of Lamar Miller and Chris Rainey who had lousy years.

Just because a guy is fast doesn't make him better. A well rounded HB has got to be tough, be able to break tackles, be able to pass block, catch, and preferably have good size. Lacy has it all.

If Lacy runs a 4.5 like many suspect he has plenty of speed.

Arian Foster ran a 4.69 at his pro day. Does he no have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL?

Lacy will run in the 4.4s
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:13 PM
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I might get some **** for this, but we were the #6 defense in football with Maualuga and Lawson at LB..... If we upgrade at all, we're going to be top-3. If Howard isn't re-signed, I'd be absolutely on board with drafting a couple linebackers early, but I don't see it right now is all.
That's one way to look at it. Another would be: to get to the point where we're going to be playing this upcoming weekend (February), we could use someone to cover the short to intermediate routes. That falls on LBs, and what we have isn't quite up to snuff.

EDIT: saw we're keeping Sims. This isn't the first time this week. I'm not sure I'd spend a lot of money on him when we have backups that need to get PT.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:17 PM
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I might get some **** for this, but we were the #6 defense in football with Maualuga and Lawson at LB..... If we upgrade at all, we're going to be top-3. If Howard isn't re-signed, I'd be absolutely on board with drafting a couple linebackers early, but I don't see it right now is all.
With a brilliant DC, the defense is a top 10 defense. Without Zimmer, . . .
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:39 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

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Originally Posted by NATI BENGALS View Post
I think a lot of people have it seriously wrong on the speed concept of a HB.

Its not all about straight line speed. If a guy can break tackles like Lacy does he has an advantage.

Doug Martin 4.5 and Alfred Morris 4.67 sure had good years. And they don't have the speed of Lamar Miller and Chris Rainey who had lousy years.

Just because a guy is fast doesn't make him better. A well rounded HB has got to be tough, be able to break tackles, be able to pass block, catch, and preferably have good size. Lacy has it all.

If Lacy runs a 4.5 like many suspect he has plenty of speed.

Arian Foster ran a 4.69 at his pro day. Does he no have the speed to run outside the tackles in the NFL?
I was thinking the same thing when I read that. Heck the #1 rusher in Nfl history ran a 4.5-4.6. Emmit Smith. I can't recall him being a 4.4 guy. Jerry Rice the same.
People sometimes discredit game speed and that tends to win out in most cases. We could always draft Onterio McCalebb from Auburn hes a 4.3 guy but do you want him as a feature back probably not. Kick returner heck yeah.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:54 PM
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Default Re: Post Pro-Bowl FA/Mock

I think we can get DHB as a cap casualty free agent pick up. They will probably have to cut him because I don't see him taking a pay cut there.
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