Ravens saved by the Refs

[Bmoreblitz]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

You obviously don't know that much about football if the above is truly your response.

1. There was a hold and a fellow poster posted a picture of it on the kickoff.

2. Since when does a ball have to be catchable for holding or illegal contact...both occurred.

3. Regardless the outcomes are not always the same. If the punter runs the clock out and a flag is thrown for holding there will still be the untimed safety punt. Had the punter ran off the last 4 seconds and the hold go uncalled...game over. IE NOT THE SAME

The flag not being called and the blatant hold tells me they were banking on running the clock down hoping for no miracle kick return.

Are you serious? How old are you honsetly?
1. Theres no holding on a double team.
2. Since it was written in the rule book:
Actions that do not constitute pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Incidental contact by a defender’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball. If there is any question whether contact is incidental, the ruling shall be no interference.

(b) Inadvertent tangling of feet when both players are playing the ball or neither player is playing the ball.

(c) Contact that would normally be considered pass interference, but the pass is clearly uncatchable by the involved players.


3.. Tell me how the outcome would not have been the same? Ravens still had to execute the safety punt. The same amount of time would still have elasped.

[gmdino]

Originally Posted by BigPapaKain

They were blinded by the photos of Ray Lewis holding their loved ones at knife point shown to them during the pre-game.

What do you think Harbaugh was yelling at that security guy during the blackout? He was telling him to remind the refs who was holding the lives of their families.

Either that or they got the replacement refs back and stuck them in some Mission Impossible style masks.

I heard he was yelling because the Ravens sideline had power and could talk to their booth while he could not.

That and he has some serious mental problems..

[RhythmicGeek]

Originally Posted by Bmoreblitz

2. Since it was written in the rule book:
Actions that do not constitute pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Incidental contact by a defender’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball. If there is any question whether contact is incidental, the ruling shall be no interference.

(b) Inadvertent tangling of feet when both players are playing the ball or neither player is playing the ball.

(c) Contact that would normally be considered pass interference, but the pass is clearly uncatchable by the involved players.

The question was not about PI, it was about holding and/or illegal contact. There is no such caveat for those two penalties regarding the ball being catchable or not.

https://uky.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_cwIWFj8Adfk8sKh

[STC]

This all reminds me of the Ohio State/Miami BCS Championship game.

Miami/Baltimore fans: It wasn't.

Ohio State/49ers fans: It was.

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by Bmoreblitz

Are you serious? How old are you honsetly?
1. Theres no holding on a double team.
2. Since it was written in the rule book:
Actions that do not constitute pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Incidental contact by a defender’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball. If there is any question whether contact is incidental, the ruling shall be no interference.

(b) Inadvertent tangling of feet when both players are playing the ball or neither player is playing the ball.

(c) Contact that would normally be considered pass interference, but the pass is clearly uncatchable by the involved players.


3.. Tell me how the outcome would not have been the same? Ravens still had to execute the safety punt. The same amount of time would still have elasped.

Evidently English is not your native language. Look up the rules for illegal contact/holding and show me where a catchable ball has anything to do with that penalty. I never said PI should have been called. If you had the capacity I'm sure you could recall holding/illegal contact penalties called even when the ball was thrown the opposite side of the field.

The fact that you are condoning not calling a blatant penalty because you think it doesn't matter only re-enforces exactly what I'm saying. The ref could not anticipate whether or not the Punter was going to run out of bounds with time left on the clock or not. It's not his job to assume there would be time on the clock netting the same result. It's his job to call an infraction if one occurs. A flag on the play was the right call regardless of whatever the outcome might be because a rule was broken...plain and simple. If you don't understand this I can't help you. You are already arguing over DPI when I never even wrote a thing about it.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

Any Steelers fans on here who are complaining about officiating are hypocrites of the worst kind. Only the Patriots get more favorable calls and non-calls than the Steelers.

[RhythmicGeek]

Originally Posted by Fan_in_Kettering

Any Steelers fans on here who are complaining about officiating are hypocrites of the worst kind. Only the Patriots get more favorable calls and non-calls than the Steelers.

See my post about favoritism for emotional games. I suggest you read some before making such generalizing statements.

[SteelCitySouth]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Evidently English is not your native language. Look up the rules for illegal contact/holding and show me where a catchable ball has anything to do with that penalty. I never said PI should have been called. If you had the capacity I'm sure you could recall holding/illegal contact penalties called even when the ball was thrown the opposite side of the field.

The fact that you are condoning not calling a blatant penalty because you think it doesn't matter only re-enforces exactly what I'm saying. The ref could not anticipate whether or not the Punter was going to run out of bounds with time left on the clock or not. It's not his job to assume there would be time on the clock netting the same result. It's his job to call an infraction if one occurs. A flag on the play was the right call regardless of whatever the outcome might be because a rule was broken...plain and simple. If you don't understand this I can't help you. You are already arguing over DPI when I never even wrote a thing about it.

Stony...I don't know if you saw it but I responded earlier to your post about the safety punt. I'm pretty sure that the game is not extended to a non timed paly in the event of an offensive penalty. That only occurs when there has been a defensive pennalty.

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by SteelCitySouth

Stony...I don't know if you saw it but I responded earlier to your post about the safety punt. I'm pretty sure that the game is not extended to a non timed paly in the event of an offensive penalty. That only occurs when there has been a defensive pennalty.

Section 8 Article 2 rule H states...

(h) If a safety results from a foul during the last play of a half, the score counts. A safety kick is made if requested by the receivers

http://static.nfl.com/static/content...ame_Timing.pdf

[michaelsean]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Section 8 Article 2 rule H states...

(h) If a safety results from a foul during the last play of a half, the score counts. A safety kick is made if requested by the receivers

http://static.nfl.com/static/content...ame_Timing.pdf

Right. So nothing would have changed. It's absolutely ridiculous that they didn't flag it, but the results would have been the same. Baltimore knew that which is why they did it.

[SteelCitySouth]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Section 8 Article 2 rule H states...

(h) If a safety results from a foul during the last play of a half, the score counts. A safety kick is made if requested by the receivers

http://static.nfl.com/static/content...ame_Timing.pdf

I stand corrected...Weird rules.

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by michaelsean

Right. So nothing would have changed. It's absolutely ridiculous that they didn't flag it, but the results would have been the same. Baltimore knew that which is why they did it.

The problem is that the ref can't foresee the future. He cannot possibly know if the punter was going to be able to run the clock out. If he had been able to the Ravens would not have had to kick the safety because the penalty went uncalled.

The ref didn't know hey it's going to be a safety anyway so I'm not throwing a flag because the time could have ran out. Bottom line was it didn't change the outcome but it could have because the guy who is getting called to do nothing else but enforce the rules of the game chose not to do his job. The same outcome defense doesn't excuse the no-call.

IMO the 49ers play calling was horrible in the red zone. So no excuse. The Ravens defense minus the missed illegal contact stepped up when it mattered.

I wonder if anyone even thinks about how much whining over the power outage would have came from the other Harbaugh and Ravens fans had the 49ers won that game.

[Bmoreblitz]

Originally Posted by michaelsean

Right. So nothing would have changed. It's absolutely ridiculous that they didn't flag it, but the results would have been the same. Baltimore knew that which is why they did it.

Exactly

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Evidently English is not your native language. Look up the rules for illegal contact/holding and show me where a catchable ball has anything to do with that penalty. I never said PI should have been called. If you had the capacity I'm sure you could recall holding/illegal contact penalties called even when the ball was thrown the opposite side of the field.

The fact that you are condoning not calling a blatant penalty because you think it doesn't matter only re-enforces exactly what I'm saying. The ref could not anticipate whether or not the Punter was going to run out of bounds with time left on the clock or not. It's not his job to assume there would be time on the clock netting the same result. It's his job to call an infraction if one occurs. A flag on the play was the right call regardless of whatever the outcome might be because a rule was broken...plain and simple. If you don't understand this I can't help you. You are already arguing over DPI when I never even wrote a thing about it.

You can call some kind of no call on 97% of all plays in any given game. I don't hear you complaining about non calls against the Ravens!

Either way IDGAF!!! You can talk about it till you turn blue and stay mad....stay a hater.

Ravens are
Super Bowl Champs!!

One day maybe you will experience the team you cheer for doing the same!! Lol

[rfaulk34]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Why would you tell your guys to hold? If for some miraculous chance they all hold and the punter runs out the clock and officials throw the flag, the game is extended to an unclocked down due to the rule that the game cannot end on a penalty.

Regardless I'm fine with the strategy if that's what Harbaugh did. The problems lies with the officiating. The game should be called to the letter of the rule book regardless if its a minute into the game or there's 11 seconds left.

You tell them to hold to kill time. It's a smart move considering the circumstances.

A game can't end on a defensive penalty. Rules are in place (time run off) to prevent the offense from stopping the clock--with no timeouts--at the end of the game by causing a penalty.

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by Bmoreblitz

Exactly


You can call some kind of no call on 97% of all plays in any given game. I don't hear you complaining about non calls against the Ravens!

Either way IDGAF!!! You can talk about it till you turn blue and stay mad....stay a hater.

Ravens are
Super Bowl Champs!!

One day maybe you will experience the team you cheer for doing the same!! Lol

Yep...if my life ****** as bad as yours I'd think the team I rooted for winning the Superbowl was the greatest accomplishment of my life as well. However did you exist before your city stole the Cleveland Browns.

I know one thing, if my team ever did win the Superbowl, the last place I'd be is in a division rivals message forum the day after arguing about calls or no-calls all day. Are you so lame that you have to seek immediate validation for another's accomplishment?

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by rfaulk34

You tell them to hold to kill time. It's a smart move considering the circumstances.

A game can't end on a defensive penalty. Rules are in place (time run off) to prevent the offense from stopping the clock--with no timeouts--at the end of the game by causing a penalty.

It's a risky call. Lets say you tell your team to hold and the penalty gets called as time runs out. That's a safety kick and an extra shot at losing the game.

It's a smart move only if you know these two things ahead of time:

1: no penalty will be called

2: and that the time will not run out

Harbaugh couldn't have possibly known either of these could he?

[rfaulk34]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Section 8 Article 2 rule H states...

(h) If a safety results from a foul during the last play of a half, the score counts. A safety kick is made if requested by the receivers

http://static.nfl.com/static/content...ame_Timing.pdf

This is the section of that rule you're looking for.

PERIOD EXTENDED
Article 2 At the election of the opponent, a period may be extended for one untimed down, if any of the
following occurs during a down during which time in the period expires:
(a) If there is a foul by the defensive team that is accepted, the offensive team may choose to extend the period by an untimed down after enforcement of the penalty. If the first or third period is not so extended, any accepted penalty is enforced before the start of the succeeding period.
(b) If there is a foul by the offense, there shall be no extension of the period. If the foul occurs on the last play of the half, a score by the offense is not counted. However, the period may be extended for an untimed down, upon the request of the defense, if the offensive team’s foul is for:
(1) illegal touching of a kick;
Note: The period may also be extended for a “First Touching” violation.
(2) fair-catch interference;
(3) a palpably unfair act;
(4) a personal foul or unsportsmanlike conduct foul committed prior to an interception of a forward
pass or the recovery of a backward pass or fumble; or
(5) a foul by the kicking team prior to a player of the receiving team securing possession of the ball during a down in which there is a safety kick, a scrimmage kick, or a free kick.

Although that specifically says "last play of the half".

The section you quoted is for double fouls.

I was under the impression that there were no untimed downs if a foul is committed by the offense, at the end of the game, period.

So basically, i'm confused...

[rfaulk34]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

It's a risky call. Lets say you tell your team to hold and the penalty gets called as time runs out. That's a safety kick and an extra shot at losing the game.

It's a smart move only if you know these two things ahead of time:

1: no penalty will be called

2: and that the time will not run out

Harbaugh couldn't have possibly known either of these could he?

No, he couldn't have known. My guess, at least what i would say is, we're giving up the safety anyway. I don't think i'd assume he'd be able to run the entire 11 seconds off so i'd expect to have to kick anyway. I'd just try and run as much time off as possible.

But i wouldn't do it like Sam tried back in '87 against the niners.

A flag definitely should have been thrown, no doubt.

[RhythmicGeek]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Yep...if my life ****** as bad as yours I'd think the team I rooted for winning the Superbowl was the greatest accomplishment of my life as well. However did you exist before your city stole the Cleveland Browns.

I know one thing, if my team ever did win the Superbowl, the last place I'd be is in a division rivals message forum the day after arguing about calls or no-calls all day. Are you so lame that you have to seek immediate validation for another's accomplishment?

I was wondering when this post was going to show up.

[Bmoreblitz]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

Yep...if my life ****** as bad as yours I'd think the team I rooted for winning the Superbowl was the greatest accomplishment of my life as well. However did you exist before your city stole the Cleveland Browns.

I know one thing, if my team ever did win the Superbowl, the last place I'd be is in a division rivals message forum the day after arguing about calls or no-calls all day. Are you so lame that you have to seek immediate validation for another's accomplishment?

Lol I do it because I get to laugh at all the butt hurt and jealous little girls like yourself
That's part of the fun of sports. Obvious it bothers you with all the tears and anger reaming from you post

[Bmoreblitz]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

It's a risky call. Lets say you tell your team to hold and the penalty gets called as time runs out. That's a safety kick and an extra shot at losing the game.

It's a smart move only if you know these two things ahead of time:

1: no penalty will be called

2: and that the time will not run out

Harbaugh couldn't have possibly known either of these could he?

How do we know that Koch wouldn't have ran out/stepped out with time remaining? True a flag should've been called but how would that have changed anything??

And I guess no flag flag should have been called on the late hit on Flacco either?

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by rfaulk34

This is the section of that rule you're looking for.

PERIOD EXTENDED
Article 2 At the election of the opponent, a period may be extended for one untimed down, if any of the
following occurs during a down during which time in the period expires:
(a) If there is a foul by the defensive team that is accepted, the offensive team may choose to extend the period by an untimed down after enforcement of the penalty. If the first or third period is not so extended, any accepted penalty is enforced before the start of the succeeding period.
(b) If there is a foul by the offense, there shall be no extension of the period. If the foul occurs on the last play of the half, a score by the offense is not counted. However, the period may be extended for an untimed down, upon the request of the defense, if the offensive team’s foul is for:
(1) illegal touching of a kick;
Note: The period may also be extended for a “First Touching” violation.
(2) fair-catch interference;
(3) a palpably unfair act;
(4) a personal foul or unsportsmanlike conduct foul committed prior to an interception of a forward
pass or the recovery of a backward pass or fumble; or
(5) a foul by the kicking team prior to a player of the receiving team securing possession of the ball during a down in which there is a safety kick, a scrimmage kick, or a free kick.

Although that specifically says "last play of the half".

The section you quoted is for double fouls.

I was under the impression that there were no untimed downs if a foul is committed by the offense, at the end of the game, period.

So basically, i'm confused...

The section I quoted was not for double fouls.

It says verbatim (h) If a safety results from a foul during the last play of a half, the score counts. A safety kick is made if requested by the receivers

[stonyhands]

Originally Posted by Bmoreblitz

Lol I do it because I get to laugh at all the butt hurt and jealous little girls like yourself
That's part of the fun of sports. Obvious it bothers you with all the tears and anger reaming from you post

I'm so flattered you come on these boards just for me and forego having a life to do so. So your idea of fun is coming onto a Bengals Message board and rubbing in how great a sports franchise that you root for is better than the one running the forum in which you choose to do so....Wow, it must really **** to be you.

[Bmoreblitz]

Originally Posted by stonyhands

I'm so flattered you come on these boards just for me and forego having a life to do so. So your idea of fun is coming onto a Bengals Message board and rubbing in how great a sports franchise that you root for is better than the one running the forum in which you choose to do so....Wow, it must really **** to be you.

Super Bowl champs!!
Lol.......this is a section of a forum called SMACK talk. In case you didn't know, it was created for opposing fans to talk smack. It has nothing to do with life in general as you may think. You are on the same board as I am.

It must **** to be you if it bothers you that much because another fan has bragging rights. Lol

[rfaulk34]

Originally Posted by Bmoreblitz

How do we know that Koch wouldn't have ran out/stepped out with time remaining? True a flag should've been called but how would that have changed anything??

And I guess no flag flag should have been called on the late hit on Flacco either?

As soon as they hit Flacco, i said out loud (my wife and son were watching too) "there's 15 yards" and i was surprised when they didn't call anything. It was close but i expected to see yellow.