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  #26  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:55 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
If you draft Rhodes; Kirkpatrick, Ghee and Prater will stop progressing. Do you really want to stop their progression?
Very true, but if the guy's a special talent(not saying Rhodes is because I really know) at a premium position, you would have to give it a lot of thought.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:01 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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If you draft Rhodes; Kirkpatrick, Ghee and Prater will stop progressing. Do you really want to stop their progression?
That couldn't be further from the truth. You can play 4-5 cbs per game. There are plenty of snaps where a team is in 3 or 4 wide.

I don't want to draft a CB in the first 2 rounds, but I wouldn't be worried about player development since so many guys get on the field each game.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:02 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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That couldn't be further from the truth. You can play 4-5 cbs per game. There are plenty of snaps where a team is in 3 or 4 wide.

I don't want to draft a CB in the first 2 rounds, but I wouldn't be worried about player development since so many guys get on the field each game.
It's a jab at OSU and his reasoning for not wanting a WR in the first.
He said drafting one would stop Sanu and Jones from progressing.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:43 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
It's a jab at OSU and his reasoning for not wanting a WR in the first.
He said drafting one would stop Sanu and Jones from progressing.
I don't want a WR in the 1st because I see no value in it unless by some miracle from heaven Patterson was left sitting their for us. I also believe Sanu is going to be a very solid #2 in the mold of a TJ. He will play outside and move into the slot on three receiver sets.

I am not so naive as to believe Sanu and Jones have peaked after a rookie campaign. When in general most WRs do not show much impact until their second seasons. Now if you could point me in the direction of the Calvin Johnson, AJ Green, or Julio Jones in this draft then I may be able to see the value. Short of that you are looking at yet another receiver we are looking to develop into a productive player when you passing on players that could make immediate impact.

I know just insanity isn't it.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:45 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
It's a jab at OSU and his reasoning for not wanting a WR in the first.
He said drafting one would stop Sanu and Jones from progressing.
Just keep being a Lebeau it's all good man.
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:59 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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I don't want a WR in the 1st because I see no value in it unless by some miracle from heaven Patterson was left sitting their for us. I also believe Sanu is going to be a very solid #2 in the mold of a TJ. He will play outside and move into the slot on three receiver sets.

I am not so naive as to believe Sanu and Jones have peaked after a rookie campaign. When in general most WRs do not show much impact until their second seasons. Now if you could point me in the direction of the Calvin Johnson, AJ Green, or Julio Jones in this draft then I may be able to see the value. Short of that you are looking at yet another receiver we are looking to develop into a productive player when you passing on players that could make immediate impact.

I know just insanity isn't it.
agreed!! not any WR in this class that have neear the talent of calvin aj or julio. il pass on drafting a wr unless yes cordarelle fell to us. but i doubt it.
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Old 02-08-2013, 06:26 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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I don't want a WR in the 1st because I see no value in it unless by some miracle from heaven Patterson was left sitting their for us. I also believe Sanu is going to be a very solid #2 in the mold of a TJ. He will play outside and move into the slot on three receiver sets.

I am not so naive as to believe Sanu and Jones have peaked after a rookie campaign. When in general most WRs do not show much impact until their second seasons. Now if you could point me in the direction of the Calvin Johnson, AJ Green, or Julio Jones in this draft then I may be able to see the value. Short of that you are looking at yet another receiver we are looking to develop into a productive player when you passing on players that could make immediate impact.

I know just insanity isn't it.
So which CB is coming in and playing over Hall, Kirk, Newman or maybe even Pacman in there first year? Hell even a healthy Allen might be fighting for playing time this year so I really don't understand the big need for a CB.

Also you claim its value but Rhodes is rated as a 1-2 guy in a lot of places so the possibility he is the best value is debatable. If we brought back Newman and Pacman, didn't cut Allen I would be willing to bet a 1st round WR would get more playing time than a 1st round CB barring injury.

I am a fan of Rhodes but I just don't see CB being a huge need right now unless we decide to cut Allen and not resign Pacman or Newman but since I see all three of those guys being here next year I think were good at CB for atleast another year.

If you want a CB and dont like Pacman, Newman and Allen then find a guy in FA. Cut Allen sign either Pacman or Newman back and go and get Rodgers - Cromartie or Derek Cox. Other than that I think CB can wait until round 3 or later this year.
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  #33  
Old 02-08-2013, 06:30 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by BobJones4980 View Post
So which CB is coming in and playing over Hall, Kirk, Newman or maybe even Pacman in there first year? Hell even a healthy Allen might be fighting for playing time this year so I really don't understand the big need for a CB.

Also you claim its value but Rhodes is rated as a 1-2 guy in a lot of places so the possibility he is the best value is debatable. If we brought back Newman and Pacman, didn't cut Allen I would be willing to bet a 1st round WR would get more playing time than a 1st round CB barring injury.

I am a fan of Rhodes but I just don't see CB being a huge need right now unless we decide to cut Allen and not resign Pacman or Newman but since I see all three of those guys being here next year I think were good at CB for atleast another year.

If you want a CB and dont like Pacman, Newman and Allen then find a guy in FA. Cut Allen sign either Pacman or Newman back and go and get Rodgers - Cromartie or Derek Cox. Other than that I think CB can wait until round 3 or later this year.
It has started...I feel it coming.....
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  #34  
Old 02-08-2013, 06:41 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by BobJones4980 View Post
So which CB is coming in and playing over Hall, Kirk, Newman or maybe even Pacman in there first year? Hell even a healthy Allen might be fighting for playing time this year so I really don't understand the big need for a CB.

Also you claim its value but Rhodes is rated as a 1-2 guy in a lot of places so the possibility he is the best value is debatable. If we brought back Newman and Pacman, didn't cut Allen I would be willing to bet a 1st round WR would get more playing time than a 1st round CB barring injury.

I am a fan of Rhodes but I just don't see CB being a huge need right now unless we decide to cut Allen and not resign Pacman or Newman but since I see all three of those guys being here next year I think were good at CB for atleast another year.

If you want a CB and dont like Pacman, Newman and Allen then find a guy in FA. Cut Allen sign either Pacman or Newman back and go and get Rodgers - Cromartie or Derek Cox. Other than that I think CB can wait until round 3 or later this year.
Frankly I could see Rhodes starting over any CB you mentioned other than Hall. Anything else? You act as if Adam Jones and Newman are considered premier CBs in the NFL.
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Old 02-08-2013, 06:54 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Originally Posted by BobJones4980 View Post
So which CB is coming in and playing over Hall, Kirk, Newman or maybe even Pacman in there first year? Hell even a healthy Allen might be fighting for playing time this year so I really don't understand the big need for a CB.

Also you claim its value but Rhodes is rated as a 1-2 guy in a lot of places so the possibility he is the best value is debatable. If we brought back Newman and Pacman, didn't cut Allen I would be willing to bet a 1st round WR would get more playing time than a 1st round CB barring injury.

I am a fan of Rhodes but I just don't see CB being a huge need right now unless we decide to cut Allen and not resign Pacman or Newman but since I see all three of those guys being here next year I think were good at CB for atleast another year.

If you want a CB and dont like Pacman, Newman and Allen then find a guy in FA. Cut Allen sign either Pacman or Newman back and go and get Rodgers - Cromartie or Derek Cox. Other than that I think CB can wait until round 3 or later this year.

Weather we need a CB or not, if Rhodes is the BPA at 21 you take him. There is nothing at all wrong with having an overload of players that all can play, at a premium position. (yep, that was a tie-in from another thread...)

Having that "overload of talent" gives the team bargaining chips to acquire players they might need from other teams.
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  #36  
Old 02-08-2013, 07:02 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Weather we need a CB or not, if Rhodes is the BPA at 21 you take him. There is nothing at all wrong with having an overload of players that all can play, at a premium position. (yep, that was a tie-in from another thread...)

Having that "overload of talent" gives the team bargaining chips to acquire players they might need from other teams.
Amen brother.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:04 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Frankly I could see Rhodes starting over any CB you mentioned other than Hall. Anything else? You act as if Adam Jones and Newman are considered premier CBs in the NFL.
Im not acting as if Jones and Newman are premier CBs but they are solid players for us along with Kirk being a 1st round pick from last year that they obviously feel will be a good player, throw in Allen who was a very solid CB in Houston and was held back by injuries here and I think our CBs are alot more solid than other positions such as SS, WLB, SLB, RB, WR. Some would even argue DE and OC would be ahead of CB this year.

I also don't really see the value here, 21 would be a reasonable spot for Rhodes but not great value and not a top need. I would rather fill more pressing needs and grab a CB that falls in 3-4 to groom and maybe grab one early next year.
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  #38  
Old 02-08-2013, 07:09 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

I'd be ok with a corner in round 1 but i'm not sold on Rhodes.

I like J. Po the most.
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  #39  
Old 02-08-2013, 07:13 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

really? Jordan Poyer in the 1st? curious, why Poyer in the 1st? Do you think he's that good or just saying you'd be ok with corner in 1st
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:14 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Im not acting as if Jones and Newman are premier CBs but they are solid players for us along with Kirk being a 1st round pick from last year that they obviously feel will be a good player, throw in Allen who was a very solid CB in Houston and was held back by injuries here and I think our CBs are alot more solid than other positions such as SS, WLB, SLB, RB, WR. Some would even argue DE and OC would be ahead of CB this year.

I also don't really see the value here, 21 would be a reasonable spot for Rhodes but not great value and not a top need. I would rather fill more pressing needs and grab a CB that falls in 3-4 to groom and maybe grab one early next year.
Not great value for Rhodes? Some are saying he could end up the best CB to come out of this class. However you would see a value in passing on the best player available?

So at WLB, SLB, S, and RB what players at those positions offer a higher value than Rhodes? Ogletree appears at this point to be off the board. Vacarro should be off the board, there is not a RB in this draft projecting this high. The only WR I could see using the selection on would be Patterson and he will be long gone.

So who do you see as better player available if indeed Rhodes is there at 21?
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:16 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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I'd be ok with a corner in round 1 but i'm not sold on Rhodes.

I like J. Po the most.
Not sold on a 6'1" 217 lb. CB that can run? I am certainly intrigued now. So want do you see in his game to say this?
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:29 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Not great value for Rhodes? Some are saying he could end up the best CB to come out of this class. However you would see a value in passing on the best player available?

So at WLB, SLB, S, and RB what players at those positions offer a higher value than Rhodes? Ogletree appears at this point to be off the board. Vacarro should be off the board, there is not a RB in this draft projecting this high. The only WR I could see using the selection on would be Patterson and he will be long gone.

So who do you see as better player available if indeed Rhodes is there at 21?
Some are saying he could end up the best CB in this class while some have him as the 6th best CB in the draft, it all depends on who your asking, right now the guy is rated late first early second. Its just my opinion taking a guy where he is slated or maybe even a little early isn't considered great value.

Better value I could see Jarvis Jones(Falling), Alec Ogletree, Arthur Brown, Ezekiel Ansah, Alex Okafor, Keenan Allen, Cordarrelle Patterson, If Vaccaro happened to be around he would be on that list also, some want an OG and a guy like Cooper would be better value if we ignore need. A few of those guys are all over the place in rankings atm but I could see them all being better picks than Rhodes come draft day.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:32 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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I could see us taking the best player avaialable with our 1st pick. I don't think we should use our 1st pick on a DE, OLB, S, or a RB, because I don't believe in the players that are ranked high. I think there are better players in later rounds....I would take Rhodes in the 1st round since Kirkpatrick is unproven and is unhealthy. I could see a stacked CB core with Hall, Rhodes, & Kirkpatrick. It would give our D line more time to get to the qb & with our 2A pick we should take Margus Hunt at DE while resigning MJ to give us some rotation since we seem to be thin at DE. I think Rhodes will be a dominant CB in the league & would be a great pick for us in the 1st.
What do you call Rhodes? Proven? I think not. I wouldn't hate the pick but I don't have think he is one of the top CBs. He lacks consistency, the measurables are there but I do have my doubts.

I don't think we need Defense, we won't ignore it, but we don't need to draft high for it.
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:28 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Some are saying he could end up the best CB in this class while some have him as the 6th best CB in the draft, it all depends on who your asking, right now the guy is rated late first early second. Its just my opinion taking a guy where he is slated or maybe even a little early isn't considered great value.

Better value I could see Jarvis Jones(Falling), Alec Ogletree, Arthur Brown, Ezekiel Ansah, Alex Okafor, Keenan Allen, Cordarrelle Patterson, If Vaccaro happened to be around he would be on that list also, some want an OG and a guy like Cooper would be better value if we ignore need. A few of those guys are all over the place in rankings atm but I could see them all being better picks than Rhodes come draft day.
Ansah? Not sure what or who's rankings you are looking at. Ansah will not make it to the second half of the first round. Very few rankings if any have Arthur Brown in the first round.
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:59 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Not sold on a 6'1" 217 lb. CB that can run? I am certainly intrigued now. So want do you see in his game to say this?
It's not so much a knock on Rhodes as it is a compliment toward Poyer.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Ansah? Not sure what or who's rankings you are looking at. Ansah will not make it to the second half of the first round. Very few rankings if any have Arthur Brown in the first round.
So you pick 2 guys out of 9 to complain about and then ignore the rest? Yea Ansah most likely wont be there but is that all you got out of the entire reply?

Why is it you feel Rhodes is the best value at 21? Its not a huge need but even if it was its not great value like you claim considering most have him late first early second. There should be good DE's, OLB's , WR's and potentially S or OG that would be just as good value wise and fit a need. Hell if were going straight BPA we could probably look at some DT's and TE's that would probably be of better or equal value to Rhodes so why not take one of them?

You gotta give me more than his size and some claim that he might be the best CB in the draft when its all said and done to show me he would be BPA.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:18 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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So which CB is coming in and playing over Hall, Kirk, Newman or maybe even Pacman in there first year? Hell even a healthy Allen might be fighting for playing time this year so I really don't understand the big need for a CB.

Also you claim its value but Rhodes is rated as a 1-2 guy in a lot of places so the possibility he is the best value is debatable. If we brought back Newman and Pacman, didn't cut Allen I would be willing to bet a 1st round WR would get more playing time than a 1st round CB barring injury.

I am a fan of Rhodes but I just don't see CB being a huge need right now unless we decide to cut Allen and not resign Pacman or Newman but since I see all three of those guys being here next year I think were good at CB for atleast another year.

If you want a CB and dont like Pacman, Newman and Allen then find a guy in FA. Cut Allen sign either Pacman or Newman back and go and get Rodgers - Cromartie or Derek Cox. Other than that I think CB can wait until round 3 or later this year.
If you draft a CB in the first it's because the value is too good to pass up. It's not a right now pick, for sure, unless he walks right in like Revis and then nobody will have a problem with the pick and having a stable of good DB's.

You're looking who's there and you ask yourself who's the best player for our team. Then you see how it fits need. If value and need don't intersect, I believe value and the quality of the player trump need in the first round.

You can pay more attention to need after the first. You gotta hit that first pick, obviously, and the best way to do that is to take the best player available. Unless you're absolutely loaded at the position, if he's better than the guy in that spot now, then you've just gotten better.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:49 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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If you draft a CB in the first it's because the value is too good to pass up. It's not a right now pick, for sure, unless he walks right in like Revis and then nobody will have a problem with the pick and having a stable of good DB's.

You're looking who's there and you ask yourself who's the best player for our team. Then you see how it fits need. If value and need don't intersect, I believe value and the quality of the player trump need in the first round.

You can pay more attention to need after the first. You gotta hit that first pick, obviously, and the best way to do that is to take the best player available. Unless you're absolutely loaded at the position, if he's better than the guy in that spot now, then you've just gotten better.
I get that but I don't think that's the case here, I don't really see how he would be BPA at this point. Rhodes is a guy slated to go around or after our pick, taking him at 21 would be reasonable but to say he would be BPA or great value is a stretch.

I also have to disagree with you here, sure BPA is great but you have to include need in the equation even in the first round, not to mention there is so much room for interpretation for who is the BPA so late in round 1 but I consider it to be guys who fall on draft day not a guy that was slated to go after our pick.
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:10 PM
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Default Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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Frankly I could see Rhodes starting over any CB you mentioned other than Hall. Anything else? You act as if Adam Jones and Newman are considered premier CBs in the NFL.
"But Newman exceeded expectations and was the 19th-ranked corner by Pro Football Focus. "
http://www.cincyjungle.com/2013/2/7/...e-sign-and-who

I have read that Pacman was ranked even better than Newman.
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Old 02-08-2013, 11:25 PM
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bengals Re: Xavier Rhodes with our 1st pick?

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So you pick 2 guys out of 9 to complain about and then ignore the rest? Yea Ansah most likely wont be there but is that all you got out of the entire reply?

Why is it you feel Rhodes is the best value at 21? Its not a huge need but even if it was its not great value like you claim considering most have him late first early second. There should be good DE's, OLB's , WR's and potentially S or OG that would be just as good value wise and fit a need. Hell if were going straight BPA we could probably look at some DT's and TE's that would probably be of better or equal value to Rhodes so why not take one of them?

You gotta give me more than his size and some claim that he might be the best CB in the draft when its all said and done to show me he would be BPA.
Show me he isnt.
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