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  #26  
Old 02-07-2013, 12:22 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

To be honest, I think any of the top linebackers could start for us next year.

I like Brown if we can get him at 37 (I'd be okay if we took him at 21, but not thrilled), same with Greene.

I would love to get Ogletree at 21, but I wouldn't trade up for him.

I'd be happy with Minter at the bottom of the 2nd or 3rd round.

Reddick or Porter in the 3rd or 4th wouldn't bother me either.

If we took Te'o at 21 I wouldn't be upset, though I agree with everyone that says he sounds like a Maualuga clone. But remember we weren't afraid of Maualuga when we drafted him. He just happened to bust. That's not a guarantee that any player like him will be equally bad. If Te'o is less like a statue and more like a moving wall, I think he'd be perfect for our defense.

If we draft Brown or Greene, we need to find an SLB somewhere. Howard is a WLB but I think he could take over SLB if we found the right rookie to supplant him.

Minter, Te'o and Ogletree could keep Burfict outside and Reddick and Porter could begin as backups and slowly work into a rotation of LBs.

Bottom line, drafting any of these players would improve our defense and I'm really excited to see them in the combine and other workouts.
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  #27  
Old 02-07-2013, 12:23 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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Originally Posted by Burma View Post
I think the biggest surprise and snub is TE Michael Williams was not invited. Also snubbed were Branden Smith and Kenn Tate.




I saw that and just shrugged. The lowest I had seen him rated was 10th best which I thought was low but possible. 18th just seems laughable. Now Shawn Williams being ranked that high is worrisome, as I was hoping he would a slide under the radar to our 4th. Now he looks like we would have to use our 3rd on him.
same.

Came here to post just that; HTF is he NOT a combine invite?

Hopefully it helps keep his stock low
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  #28  
Old 02-07-2013, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by crazyjdawg View Post
To be honest, I think any of the top linebackers could start for us next year.

I like Brown if we can get him at 37 (I'd be okay if we took him at 21, but not thrilled), same with Greene.

I would love to get Ogletree at 21, but I wouldn't trade up for him.

I'd be happy with Minter at the bottom of the 2nd or 3rd round.

Reddick or Porter in the 3rd or 4th wouldn't bother me either.

If we took Te'o at 21 I wouldn't be upset, though I agree with everyone that says he sounds like a Maualuga clone. But remember we weren't afraid of Maualuga when we drafted him. He just happened to bust. That's not a guarantee that any player like him will be equally bad. If Te'o is less like a statue and more like a moving wall, I think he'd be perfect for our defense.

If we draft Brown or Greene, we need to find an SLB somewhere. Howard is a WLB but I think he could take over SLB if we found the right rookie to supplant him.

Minter, Te'o and Ogletree could keep Burfict outside and Reddick and Porter could begin as backups and slowly work into a rotation of LBs.

Bottom line, drafting any of these players would improve our defense and I'm really excited to see them in the combine and other workouts.
This pretty much sums it up for me as well. I think we take 2-3 LBs in this draft when it is all said and done.

There are far too many question marks on this team to risk going into next season without having a ton of depth at the position.

As of now, you are looking at Lawson, Howard and Rey all gone. I'm sure we will sign one of them back, but it's pretty slim right now.
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  #29  
Old 02-07-2013, 01:12 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

Glad to see them give Quinton Patton his due.
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  #30  
Old 02-07-2013, 01:19 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

The only thing I don't like is that you can't look back on their grades from previous years. I mean, ESPN grades their players and keeps those grades up, even if they are horribly wrong. IE: Mike Wallace was rated a 59, obviously he is not. Heck, Juquan Iglesias was rated higher than him.

So I don't always get REALLY into NFL.com rankings all the time. They do raise points, but still, I'd like to be able to look back on previous years and see what they said about players and see where they are now.
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  #31  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:26 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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Originally Posted by OchoCincos View Post
Most appealing thing to me about Brown is his ability to shed blocks. There were so many times I would see our LBs (mainly Maualuga) get stuck on blocks and see the ball carrier run right by them. Brown adding some more strength should allow him to do this even better. Ogletree is probably a better athlete, but he is somewhat raw at LB and is not as good at shedding blocks (yet anyway).
Ogletree runs around blockers instead of taking them on.
Cant do that in the NFL
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  #32  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:27 PM
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he gets plenty of love. Too much imo. People have been raving about him. his brother fumbling his arse off for the eagles at the end of the year gave him a spotlight and people have took off with him. oh the awesome guy who transferred from miami and plays lb... And then i saw him play and came back down to earth.
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  #33  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:32 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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Originally Posted by BengalUSCfan View Post
I'm thinking that linebacker is a little further down our wish list than some may expect.

Brandon Joiner, Aaron Maybin, and Thomas Howard are all new faces compared to our 2012 crew. Vontaze seems a lock for the middle.

Offense was MUCH lower ranked than Defense and will command earlier attention in the draft. Kirkpatrick is still iffy at corner and Reggie Nelson's counterpart is unlikely to be older than 35... Taylor Mays will be a run support safety, but he's a soup sandwich in coverage.

I'll be shocked if we go LB with either of those first two picks. Maybe at the bottom of the 2nd round.
Howard is 30 and coming off an ACL.
Maybin ***** and Joiner just got out of the joint.

I would be surprised if more than one, let alone all 3, made the team
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  #34  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:39 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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Originally Posted by berserkerone88 View Post
Ogletree runs around blockers instead of taking them on.
Cant do that in the NFL
This, he plays linebacker like he is still a safety. Greene is in the same boat. Arthur Brown is the most "experienced" linebacker of the 3 of them.

Also would like to point out that the Bengals have a converted safety already with a year of NFL linebacker experience in Lamur. I wonder if Lamur would have been drafted if he was converted to linebacker before coming out of college because his big knock was that he was huge for a safety and played in the box instead of deep coverage.
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  #35  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:41 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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I really havent seen too much on A Brown outside of reading the lovers and haters on the board. I watched the Oregon / K-State but he didnt really stand out to me. I guess I need someone to sell me on him. I personally like Ogletree because the guy is an athetic FREAK who is most likely going to be an OLB in the NFL. I will tell you that seeing A. Brown compared to Navarro Bowman is extremely appealing. Bowman is very underrated in my opinion. He is a great LB.

RB position is going to be based off what type of back the Bengals are looking for. Does anyone know what type of back Hue will be looking for? Lacy? Bernard? I personally want to see Lacy in Bengals stripes. Bernard would be great as well. A lot of people have been clamoring about Michael from A&M but he seems to be hurt way too much.

WR, Safety will also need to be addressed!
Ogletree is a better athlete.
Brown is a better LB.

Ogletree struggles to play the run consistently from the LB spot. Too often takes the hit rather than delivering it. Freelances at times because he doesn't yet understand the position fully. Gets out of position and uses his athleticism to cover up for it. Amazing coverage skills for a LB.

As I have said elsewhere, his size/speed/athleticism and coverage skills say first round pick. His actual game footage and tentativeness vs the run say 2nd round.
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  #36  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:41 PM
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Default Re: NFL releases Combine invite list

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This, he plays linebacker like he is still a safety. Greene is in the same boat. Arthur Brown is the most "experienced" linebacker of the 3 of them.

Also would like to point out that the Bengals have a converted safety already with a year of NFL linebacker experience in Lamur. I wonder if Lamur would have been drafted if he was converted to linebacker before coming out of college because his big knock was that he was huge for a safety and played in the box instead of deep coverage.
Greene progressed nicely this year with that. Needs to get stronger. Shows flashes of it.
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Old 02-07-2013, 03:44 PM
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Greene progressed nicely this year with that. Needs to get stronger. Shows flashes of it.
Greene's draft status will depend alot on how many times he can put up 225 at the combine. But I too think Greene is the bigger playmaker out of the 3 of them.
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  #38  
Old 02-07-2013, 03:47 PM
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Greene's draft status will depend alot on how many times he can put up 225 at the combine. But I too think Greene is the bigger playmaker out of the 3 of them.
Absolutely.
Few have a nose for the big play like he does.
I will be happy with any of Brown, Greene or Ogletree.
I think the first would have a more immediate impact than Ogletree.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:41 PM
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All the Rambo fans around here can't be pleased with these rankings. 18th best Safety with a 61.4
Yeah but rankings are a joke.I don't know who did the rankings but they need to get another job because they're idiots.They also have Cyprien ranked higher than Elam and every other safety except Vacarro and maybe Reid.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:47 PM
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Ogletree is a better athlete.
Brown is a better LB.

Ogletree struggles to play the run consistently from the LB spot. Too often takes the hit rather than delivering it. Freelances at times because he doesn't yet understand the position fully. Gets out of position and uses his athleticism to cover up for it. Amazing coverage skills for a LB.

As I have said elsewhere, his size/speed/athleticism and coverage skills say first round pick. His actual game footage and tentativeness vs the run say 2nd round.
I want to know who has the bigger upside and that is Ogletree.He made 111 tackles on the year and missed some games.Ogletree is a great cover guy,and has the frame to add more weight and get up around 240-245 and still keep his skills.This is why everyone has him as possibly a top 15 pick.If we get Ogletree in 1 he can be in a rotation with Howard if we resign him.
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  #41  
Old 02-07-2013, 06:51 PM
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I'm thinking that linebacker is a little further down our wish list than some may expect.

Brandon Joiner, Aaron Maybin, and Thomas Howard are all new faces compared to our 2012 crew. Vontaze seems a lock for the middle.

Offense was MUCH lower ranked than Defense and will command earlier attention in the draft. Kirkpatrick is still iffy at corner and Reggie Nelson's counterpart is unlikely to be older than 35... Taylor Mays will be a run support safety, but he's a soup sandwich in coverage.

I'll be shocked if we go LB with either of those first two picks. Maybe at the bottom of the 2nd round.
Lewis loves drafting lb's and the last good lb we drafted was Thurman from the Georgia Bulldogs.It also doesnt mean anything about wish list because in round 1 you're suppose to take BPA and fill needs later.So if Vacarro some how makes it to 21 then he should be the guy over any linebacker since everyone has him rated higher.
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  #42  
Old 02-08-2013, 09:37 PM
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I can't believe Dennis Johnson or Micheal Williams wasn't invited to combine
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  #43  
Old 02-08-2013, 10:15 PM
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Woulda liked to have seen Jahleel Addae and Ray Ray Armstrong get an invite at Safety.

Last edited by bfine32; 02-08-2013 at 10:17 PM.
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  #44  
Old 02-08-2013, 11:44 PM
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This, he plays linebacker like he is still a safety. Greene is in the same boat. Arthur Brown is the most "experienced" linebacker of the 3 of them.

Also would like to point out that the Bengals have a converted safety already with a year of NFL linebacker experience in Lamur. I wonder if Lamur would have been drafted if he was converted to linebacker before coming out of college because his big knock was that he was huge for a safety and played in the box instead of deep coverage.



He was a WLB coming out. Hartman and Zimmerman were KSU's starting FS and SS.
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  #45  
Old 02-09-2013, 12:24 AM
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He gets plenty of love. Too much IMO. People have been raving about him. His brother fumbling his arse off for the Eagles at the end of the year gave him a spotlight and people have took off with him. Oh the awesome guy who transferred from Miami and plays LB... And then I saw him play and came back down to earth.

Always thought Te'O was questionable when people were calling him a top 10 pick. Now he is dropping. Ogletree gets a lot of love (too much) because he is the best athlete from Georgia's D. Like I have seen some say Minter would be a 2nd or 3rd round pick if this was a stronger LB class.

I dislike the LB class a whole.



Better be a 4.5 because a slow small LB should never be able to get a 90.

I'd take Keith Rivers 10/10 times if the option was to draft him or A. Brown coming out of college with the LB needs we have right now. That's one of the reasons Brown scares me so much.

And the fact Zimmer has made UDFA Burfict and Raider cast of Howard look pretty damn good at WILL. I just don't think using a first round pick on the position is worth it. We can find a damn good option with far less of an opportunity cost than using a first round pick on one.

And Marvin won't start a rookie at MLB, especially an undersized one, so that takes Brown out of the MLB spot and basically locks him in to WILL.

I like Howard. I like Lemur. And if Mays can't cut it at S I want to try him at LB. I'd rather go with any of those three at WILL than using a first round pick on A. Brown.

Just some of my explanation for not being on the bandwagon.
Obviously your opinion is yours but, You must not have seen him play and I don't think his brother has anything to do with it.
I dont know if people realize that a guy like Ogeltree played with a 8 guys that will get drafted one a first round DT. Brown played with maybe 2, late rounders, M. Williams and Malone.

If you like Lemur, Brown was twice the player Lemur was in college. Just not as tall.
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  #46  
Old 02-09-2013, 03:29 AM
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Obviously your opinion is yours but, You must not have seen him play and I don't think his brother has anything to do with it.
I dont know if people realize that a guy like Ogeltree played with a 8 guys that will get drafted one a first round DT. Brown played with maybe 2, late rounders, M. Williams and Malone.

If you like Lemur, Brown was twice the player Lemur was in college. Just not as tall.
Lemur cost us nothing to acquire. I don't think Brown is an absolute bum. I just don't think he is worth the 21st pick in the draft. I'm pretty sure you have said the same thing. I saw him play twice. And in no way did he jump out to like a must have player.

IMO if you are the best player on a talent deprived team you should rack up the stats, especially if you are a LB.

He will probably be a solid pro. But he is not going to bring our D to the next level. And he is not going to be a player opposing offenses change game plans for.

I like Lemur because he has NFL game experience and I thought he showed well.

Whether you or anybody else wants to admit it or not his brother getting national exposure in the NFL and having big games greatly enhanced his name recognition.
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  #47  
Old 02-09-2013, 09:21 AM
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Lemur cost us nothing to acquire. I don't think Brown is an absolute bum. I just don't think he is worth the 21st pick in the draft. I'm pretty sure you have said the same thing. I saw him play twice. And in no way did he jump out to like a must have player.

IMO if you are the best player on a talent deprived team you should rack up the stats, especially if you are a LB.

He will probably be a solid pro. But he is not going to bring our D to the next level. And he is not going to be a player opposing offenses change game plans for.

I like Lemur because he has NFL game experience and I thought he showed well.

Whether you or anybody else wants to admit it or not his brother getting national exposure in the NFL and having big games greatly enhanced his name recognition.
No I don't believe he is a first rounder because drafting any non passrushing LB in the first is not getting the best value in my opinion, see Kieth Rivers. Same with Teo and Minter.
.
But to be honest I would have welcomed a "solid pro" last year in the middle.

With that said, Bill Snyder runs a very similar D to what we do and Brown only rushed the passer a handful of times.
The surprisingly stout playmaker posted an eerily similar season in 2012 as he had his first season in Manhattan, recording 100 tackles, seven tackles for loss, two interceptions and a sack despite being the focus of every offense.
Cbssports.

He and his brother already had national attention as five star recruits coming out, of Witchta KS. Most casual or non local fans don't know this.
You can speak for your self but Authur earned his recognition, his 7th round draft pick brother who quite on his teams in college had nothing to do with him winning the 2011 Big 12 newcomer of the year award or being a LOTT trouphy finalist this year.

IMO that's a lazy statement about a player you really know very little about.
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  #48  
Old 02-09-2013, 01:23 PM
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No I don't believe he is a first rounder because drafting any non passrushing LB in the first is not getting the best value in my opinion, see Kieth Rivers. Same with Teo and Minter.
.
But to be honest I would have welcomed a "solid pro" last year in the middle.

With that said, Bill Snyder runs a very similar D to what we do and Brown only rushed the passer a handful of times.
The surprisingly stout playmaker posted an eerily similar season in 2012 as he had his first season in Manhattan, recording 100 tackles, seven tackles for loss, two interceptions and a sack despite being the focus of every offense.
Cbssports.

He and his brother already had national attention as five star recruits coming out, of Witchta KS. Most casual or non local fans don't know this.
You can speak for your self but Authur earned his recognition, his 7th round draft pick brother who quite on his teams in college had nothing to do with him winning the 2011 Big 12 newcomer of the year award or being a LOTT trouphy finalist this year.

IMO that's a lazy statement about a player you really know very little about.
Ok so I am not in the Arthur Brown fan club and know little about him other than watching two games and reading what is available, but my opinion of him mirrors yours the KSU specialist.

You can only go away from a MLB so much, he is in the middle. I expect 100 tackles from a MLB if he plays in every game, its like 1000 yards for a HB, a milestone that isn't that impressive, its required. Like I said, NFL offenses will not focus on Arthur Brown unless they see the opportunity to physically dominate him. Totally different than being the best player on a college team.

I didn't say his brother created his name recognition. Just that he enhanced it. Just about every site mentions his brother when they are talking about Arthur. If you haven't noticed having siblings (or any family for that matter) produce in the NFL more often than not does good things for you when you are a draft prospect. Seeing him in the first round of a mock draft before Bryce blew up was a rarity.

If the option was Brown in the 1st or Khaseem in the 2nd. I pick Greene 100/100 times.
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Old 02-09-2013, 03:07 PM
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Ok so I am not in the Arthur Brown fan club and know little about him other than watching two games and reading what is available, but my opinion of him mirrors yours the KSU specialist.

You can only go away from a MLB so much, he is in the middle. I expect 100 tackles from a MLB if he plays in every game, its like 1000 yards for a HB, a milestone that isn't that impressive, its required. Like I said, NFL offenses will not focus on Arthur Brown unless they see the opportunity to physically dominate him. Totally different than being the best player on a college team.

I didn't say his brother created his name recognition. Just that he enhanced it. Just about every site mentions his brother when they are talking about Arthur. If you haven't noticed having siblings (or any family for that matter) produce in the NFL more often than not does good things for you when you are a draft prospect. Seeing him in the first round of a mock draft before Bryce blew up was a rarity.

If the option was Brown in the 1st or Khaseem in the 2nd. I pick Greene 100/100 times.
I don't know who your favorite college team is but I'm sure you know those players better then I do. I've watched every game A.Brown has played in the past two years, 5 in person, the rest on TV.

So compared to you, yes I guess I'm a KSU specialist but I'm not a scout so who knows. I can say the KSU offense was ranked in the top 5 in 2011 and top 15 in 2012, limiting the amount of snaps he played. However KSU with Brown in the middle has had a top 15 rated rushing D the last two years. The year before Brown was in the middle 76th.

Bryce Brown had two good games, the last four games of the season he had 76 rushing yards combined. I just don't see how this pushed A.Brown up draft boards.

They are the first brothers to be five star recruits and their uncle played for the Lions so there might be something in the blood. But yes your right sometimes bloodlines get you recognition from websites, but I'm guessing scouts do more their homework
on them just the same.

To be honest I think it's all a wash anyway because the chances we draft him are probably slim anyway.
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