What Andy Dalton Needs to work on....

[BengalYankee]

[Dalton's_Gang]

Originally Posted by EyeOfTheTiger

Last night was the first time I saw him get frustrated. .

I saw him getting pretty ****** during the first ravens game.

practice
practice
practice

better offensive play calling

Could another Olineman be had in FA or the draft this year? Defense won the game last night. offense was absolutely anemic.

[Who-Dey Girl]

I think that Andy is above average at this point in his career but it would be silly to think that as a second year player he did not need to improve his mechanics. I agree with the OP.

[BoomerFan]

The way I see it, Andy is a top 20 QB in the NFL. A true pro. However, if he was able to work on what ODRAB listed, he could be top 10. Last week we saw some inaccurate throws all game long. Early in the game, Andy's WRs bailed him out. Late in the game, not so much. I question his vision too somewhat. It does appear that he doesn't always see the open man, particularly when he's on the run. And as much as I hate what Carson did to us, when you look back at Palmer in his heyday, you see long, zippy, *accurate* throws. A true thing of beauty. I think Dalton may have a longer, more successful career than Palmer, but I wonder if he'll ever be able to throw the ball like that.

[Millz]

Originally Posted by Who-Dey Girl

I think that Andy is above average at this point in his career but it would be silly to think that as a second year player he did not need to improve his mechanics. I agree with the OP.

Agreed. He does need quite a bit of improvement since he is in his 2nd year. Some folks are judging him as if he is 5 year vet, which is just moronic to do so. He has thrown for more TDs up until this point in his career than a vast majority of QBs in the history of the league through the first 31 games. And he is doing this with AJ, Gresham at times, and a revolving door at the other receiving positions.

[Millz]

Originally Posted by BengalYankee

Sorry if some choose to point positive things about Dalton. Is he really that bad in his SECOND year that we need to replace him? Has he already reached his ceiling of play? If anyone believes he cant get better because he has peaked, well whatever. Hard for me to think that he has.

[bLEEdOrangeandBlack]

Originally Posted by BengalsBong

What Andy needs to do is chew out the Olinemen including Whit and make them accountable.Way too many mistakes we had 10 flags.Instead of biting his tongue and going to sideline mad he needs to just chew these screwups out and demand them to step up and do thier damn job that would go a long way to fixing the problems with the line.Gruden and Marvin should both be doing this as well somebody needs to grow a set around here.

In order for them to listen to him he has to lead by example and do HIS damn job!!! Learn how to hit the open reciever instead of locking onto one target...watch the games again and count how many times he leaves the recievers wide open...i tell you what...he keeps that shet up and AJ will be trying his best to get outta cincy and to a real franchise with a real qb

[Shake n Blake]

Originally Posted by bLEEdOrangeandBlack

In order for them to listen to him he has to lead by example and do HIS damn job!!! Learn how to hit the open reciever instead of locking onto one target...watch the games again and count how many times he leaves the recievers wide open...i tell you what...he keeps that shet up and AJ will be trying his best to get outta cincy and to a real franchise with a real qb

Yeah, he really has all the time in the world to just relax in that huge pocket and scan the field. When you only have 0.7 seconds to throw the football, it's kinda hard not to "lock onto one target".

[CincyFeeeva]

Stop locking down on receivers (Needs to use his peripheral vision).
Work on timing accuracy on deep ball passes (this will improve with time and reps).
Learn how and when to step up in the pocket and strike (better pocket presence, again time).
Work on more of his touch throws and foot mechanics.

Point is is that Dalton, in my mind has done good in his second year compared to majority of QBs. (5th in TDs, who would ever thought). He still has plenty to work on. His ints need to drop but with time and reps he can be even more spectacular. He has shown the good, the bad and the ugly. Some people compare him on these boards to Drew Brees cause of his so called ineffective arm strength and height (which I dont believe). I can tell you that he is better than Brees was when he was in his second year in San Diego. The issue is is that franchise QBs take time to develop. It can take a while. Even Drew Brees took some time to develop. With the help of a great OC or/and a QB coach an average QB can become very good (Alex Smith). But do the fans have the patience for a QB to be great or for a QB to regress? Throwing pick 6's is no laughing matter but Dalton has the talent. Its just can it be done on a consistent basis. And I will say he can but it is going to take time like any other QB. Plus having an organization that sets you up to succeed in every way helps as well.

[Captain Happy Pants]

He did well and was "Ben like" (not in women's rest rooms) outside the pocket. Seems like when they ran the bootleg he was more dangerous. He throws off his back foot and stays in the pocket too long.

[Bengal4ever68]

Originally Posted by EyeOfTheTiger

Probably one of the best posts I have read in a long time. You hit the nail on the head. Dalton doesn't seem like himself from last year. I was thinking it couldn't be ALL the receivers/lines fault. I have the feeling that a lot of answers are actually already on this team but they are overlooked or aren't utilized.

My worry is this - we have played 14 games and Dalton is still doing the same bad things. Does no one tell it to his face when he messes up? Are they coddling him? Why are the same mistakes being made? He seems to always want to force it into a double or triple covered Green rather than get it to a guy who is open one on one. The thing is, look at that one interception by Hall last game. There was no need of Foles to throw that pass given how the game was going. Think of how many games we lost because of similar INTs by Dalton. Dalton hasn't been a good game manager this year. Sometimes I feel like he doesn't take things seriously enough. Last night was the first time I saw him get frustrated. He will try forcing to a triple covered Green but won't throw one to a wide open other WR. I think Green conceals a lot of Dalton's shortcomings.

I made a thread awhile back called "i miss the 2011 Dalton"...He made better throws last year than this year. It seems like to me he's trying to look perfect in his form instead of doing it naturally.

[BengalYankee]

Originally Posted by Millz

Sorry if some choose to point positive things about Dalton. Is he really that bad in his SECOND year that we need to replace him? Has he already reached his ceiling of play? If anyone believes he cant get better because he has peaked, well whatever. Hard for me to think that he has.

Why so defensive? The OP and some members gave there opinion. And when they did, out of nowhere and from all over the galaxy came the calvary. Now, unlike the OP and some other members I said not a word about anyone. I merely posted a photo of a calvary charge. Much like when Carson was around, Carson's Calvary Charged to defend him. Now we got a new Sheriff, a new King. One where if I an innocent bystander post an image of his Calvary, you ask me questons on his second year? Really??? What did I say about Ginger Jesus, that you would ask me such questions? I made no comments on his play, just posting an image of his defenders, coming running to his[Royal Highness] defense.

[Joelist]

I think the "defender" brigade rides because as a group they (we) are sick of the ridiculous hate leveled at Andy. If you look deeply enough a lot of it seems to go back to his not coming from a big program and/or not having prototypical physical characteristics.

Meanwhile he is sitting there as second year QB in an offense with only one reliable receiver (and yes I am counting Gresham - he is unreliable with all the drops, fumbles and flags), spotty running and spotty pass blocking. And he is 8-6 with the following stat line:

Year G GS Att Comp Pct Yds YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate
2012 14 14 472 295 62.5 3313 7.02 59 26 14 38/203 32 12 89.4

This is a pretty good stat line even if a QB has all the pieces on offense to play with, to say nothing of what it is when you don't (like Andy).

[Arturo Bandini]

Throwing in motion while running to the left.

[Natikid873]

When Dalton has time, 7/10 times he'll make the right throw, but you can say that
about a lot of QB's. I hope that Gruden recognizes that when your QB is is on his
arse more frequent than usual, he would call short slants and screens to get the D
off balance. It's little things like that that could make him a better player and give
him the ability to beat the blitz.

[Texas 2 Cinci]

Originally Posted by 3wt

Maybe it's because he is getting mixed messages. I don't know what the coaches are saying, but lots of people in the media have been saying that he just needs to get it to his pro bowl player (Green).

I share your concern about the pattern of unresovled mistakes. I'm not that knowledgeable and I know that every quarterback is going to leave people open - but I feel he leaves a LOT of players open, telegraphs his targets and - as the OP pointed out - has a poor sense of where to go in the pocket.

It doesn't help that he has been under a LOT of pressure - and last night was the worse protection I've ever seen for him. It was a total sieve. Players weren't just stunting and penetrating, they were just bull rushing our strongest players and shoving them into the quarterback. I'm sure that, not knowing where they were coming from, they were having difficulty making their sets, but it rubbed me raw to see Dre being pushed around like he was on casters.

I don't know what the coaches are saying to him but I have an uneasy (and irrational) feeling that Dalton peaked in college and does not have any significant upside left.

Hope I'm wrong. I love his heart and his drive. I just hope he's able to learn and adjust.

Very good post and I agree with many of your points. The effect Sanu had was unbelievable. Just have the second option of a receiver that ran a good route and consistently caught the freaking ball made the entire team look like play-off contenders. It opened up the running game which greatly improved QB protection.

Also every other opinion and instruction is hold the ball longer and let the play develop or the sacks are his fault for not getting rid os the ball of the immediately.

Dalton still has a lot of improving to do, but there were two turning points in the game. 1st was the interception and great return by the defense and second was the great effort on two runs by Dalton resulting in a touchdown instead of just settling for another field goal.

[Texas 2 Cinci]

Originally Posted by Joelist

I think the "defender" brigade rides because as a group they (we) are sick of the ridiculous hate leveled at Andy. If you look deeply enough a lot of it seems to go back to his not coming from a big program and/or not having prototypical physical characteristics.

Meanwhile he is sitting there as second year QB in an offense with only one reliable receiver (and yes I am counting Gresham - he is unreliable with all the drops, fumbles and flags), spotty running and spotty pass blocking. And he is 8-6 with the following stat line:

Year G GS Att Comp Pct Yds YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate
2012 14 14 472 295 62.5 3313 7.02 59 26 14 38/203 32 12 89.4

This is a pretty good stat line even if a QB has all the pieces on offense to play with, to say nothing of what it is when you don't (like Andy).

This +1000

[Hammerthis]

Originally Posted by Ryan Mc

I am also a fan and think that Dalton is in good shape at this point of his career. Unfortunately, I think there is something that will keep him from ever being in the top tier of NFL QBs and that is he doesn't have the great accuracy on throws to the sideline. Last night was another example of this ... a couple of short throws to the sideline were too far to the inside and almost intercepted .. he twice got bailed out by AJ snatching the ball in front of the defender. And, I think most of us would agree (Gruden even said as much in the offseason) that on deep balls the accuracy is often not there ... for example, the throw which sailed wide out of bounds deep versus San Diego when Green had his man beaten down the sideline. Anything he can do to improve that accuracy on throws to the sideline, short and deep throws, is a must.

I agree

[Shake n Blake]

Originally Posted by Joelist

I think the "defender" brigade rides because as a group they (we) are sick of the ridiculous hate leveled at Andy. If you look deeply enough a lot of it seems to go back to his not coming from a big program and/or not having prototypical physical characteristics.

Meanwhile he is sitting there as second year QB in an offense with only one reliable receiver (and yes I am counting Gresham - he is unreliable with all the drops, fumbles and flags), spotty running and spotty pass blocking. And he is 8-6 with the following stat line:

Year G GS Att Comp Pct Yds YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate
2012 14 14 472 295 62.5 3313 7.02 59 26 14 38/203 32 12 89.4

This is a pretty good stat line even if a QB has all the pieces on offense to play with, to say nothing of what it is when you don't (like Andy).

Great post, you hit the nail on the head. I don't think any of us believe that Dalton is flawless, but the kid is 17-13 as a starter and has put up really good numbers with only one reliable option. He's a good QB, period. Also, his deep ball numbers are on par with league averages, so people just need to drop that BS. I guarantee that if Andy was 6'5" and came from a big school, no one would have a problem with him. It's a perception problem.

[grnvllbuck]

I think he holds on to the ball too long. It may be Andy, it may be the play design. Again, I think we should blatantly copy the NE Patriot's offense. Brady fires in about 2 seconds...really helps his O-line.

[bodabengal]

Bootlegs are good for Andy. He excels throwing on the run....need more of it in my opinion